Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

I use rape culture all the time to describe behavior and norms that make it easier for assault and harassment of women to be normalized and dismissed. And even worse, promoted and admired.

For example, the scenario described in this reddit post I would describe as the perpetuation of rape culture.

This particular one strikes a nerve with me, because the same damned thing happened to me in fifth grade, but I didn't speak up because it's so fucking ingrained in the world I lived in at the time that I knew that there was no point. And I was socialized to think that having boobs meant you have to endure this sort of shit. Maybe I'm not serious in the way you want me to be, but I'm dead serious about observing this shit because I've had to navigate it my entire life.

Re: There but for the grace of etc.
 

There are idiots all over, but you have taken a conversation that was about a real topic, and have turned into a non-conversation about semantics. You are refusing to talk about substance because, you say, anyone who uses certain terms categorically cannot be serious. If you want to have the conversation, suggest an alternative to "rape culture" that captures what Adder and TM are getting at, e.g., as you say archaic and loathsome attitudes toward sexual assault, without the hyperbole, generalization and sensationalism that you object to. If you can't do that, you are ducking the conversation and making a show of throwing out the bath water so that you can toss the baby too.

Re: We are all Slave now.
 

You know you just dismissed basically every feminist scholar as unserious, right?

Re: There but for the grace of etc.
 

No, it's an academic feminist word. Given your already demonstrated ignorance, I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt about knowing that, although maybe had you actually read the wikipedia link...

Re: We are all Slave now.
 

Use of that term may be serious on a campus. In fact, I have no doubt it is.

I once made the Dean's List on the back of a ritalin-induced paper comparing Milton's Satan to "Sympathy for the Devil."

What occurs in liberal arts has never struck me as particularly serious.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

Rape culture is the term for that group of people who either don't recognize rapey when they see it or who try to deny all this rapeyness is a problem.

If you don't know what it is, watch Hatch, McConnell and Grassley today. They're doing a live demonstration.

You deserve a break today.
 

I believe you are referring to the McDLT (spree - commercial starring a Not Bald Jason Alexander).

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/...20140929211350

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

I'd call that Rape Denial. Rape Culture has an affirmative bent to it, like they're engaging in rape or desiring there be more rape.

Maybe Rape Denialism. It's clunky, but it better captures the intended meaning.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

That triggers a bunch of incidents I watched my daughters deal with over the last few years. Ugh. So much rape culture, not enough time to describe it all.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

No its affirmative. They are working very hard at it sometimes. Watch the hearings.

Re: There but for the grace of etc.
 

I don't think most liberal arts academics are terribly serious people. If you were trying to solve a serious problem with a pragmatic response, would you invite a liberal arts academic who'd never worked outside a campus to offer input? Maybe. But hesitantly at best.

I liked drinking with liberal arts academics. I like navel gazing with liberal arts academics. But they very rarely have the capacity to engage in pragmatic problem solving. That's a lot of why they self-select to where they are.

ETA: I took loads of classes on feminist themes in literature. First, all deconstruction of books is kind of mental masturbation. These themes people claim to find are rarely if ever actually intended by the author. But those classes were uniquely silly. We'd find references to menstruation in some 15th century poem that clearly was not really there. We'd torture texts to come up with feminist or chauvinist intent where none was present. Oddly, we never read Fear of Flying in those classes. That was introduced to me by a salty old male professor: "This is a book about a woman having sex they way she feels like having sex." He was right. And that's all anyone had to say about that book.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

I don't think any of those men is working hard to rape anyone or see more rapes occur or go unpunished. I think they're struggling mightily to deny an attempted rape occurred.

Re: We are all Slave now.
 

I'm not watching. What's happening?

Re: We are all Slave now.
 

did you know toll house cookies were invented in Egypt? supposedly by an American but you know that can be faked.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

That's an insane post. That principal is creating an environment where sexual assault is tolerated. He should be fired. That he's considering expelling her is mind-bending.

But the fact that this shit is upsetting, that it's been tolerated for too long -- it doesn't license us to degrade the language. These shorthand words that are appearing in the culture are turning serious conversations into binary conversations. You think Occupy had a point? You're an SJW. Are you straight and unaware of LGBT issues? You're CIS Male (dropped pejoratively). You think Kavanaugh's innocent? You're part of Rape Culture.

We seem to have a massive societal hard-on for categorizing people these days. You're this. He's that. She's this. You're thinking makes you X, Y, or Z. Here's how I identify you. Here is your group.

Rape Culture is an attempt - I think a failed one - to lump a ton of things under a single descriptive. We have untold numbers of words to describe the varying types of behavior comprising this societal rape denial. Why simplify? So we can fit something on Twitter? So we can blurt it out in a 30 second live hit on cable news?

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

so it's like "white privilege?" It oversimplifies? But it does convey a general thought doesn't it? Like Ty said with weather. My privilege isn't exactly Adder's, I'd explain it differently anyway. But it is short hand to convey a concept.

Re: We are all Slave now.
 

adder ggg thurgred and you are engaging sebby on another vapid point?

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

I take it you didn't read the rest of the wikipedia article? The term has been around since the 70s.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

"Weather" is an attempt -- I think a failed one -- to lump a ton of things under a single descriptive. We have untold numbers of words to describe varying types of atmospheric conditions relating to temperature, humidity, wind, precipitation, etc., and if we need more we can always borrow from the Eskimos. Why simplify? So we can fit something on Twitter? So we can go to weather.com instead of compexmultiplecategoriesofatmosphericphenonema.com? Hello? Why do you think God invented browser bookmarks?

Re: We are all Slave now.
 

As the Bible says, nothing is new under the sun.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

It's gained broad prominence recently. Previously, it was relegated to the campus. Now I hear it all over the place.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

It's a shorthand way to associate a person or group of people with a criminal act or affirmative support for that act.

It's like "drug culture," another dumb descriptive. A pot smoker, cokehead, and smack fiend are not the same animal.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

Well, then you just need to adjust and understand what people seem to mean- like I don't like the term "White privilege." See for me "privileged" were the kids from Grosse Pointe, and i was the not-privileged in comparison- I don't like the word choice- but it was chosen so I'm stuck with it. I can process what it means and consider thoughts tied to it, I mean i understand the concept.

Similarly "rape culture" means attitudes and behavior that lead to men behaving badly generally, and sometimes raping, yes, but it is more than that. might "boorish men behaviour culture" been more broadly accurate? Maybe. But no one here coined the phrase. "Only God works from whole cloth, man must work with what came before."

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

Is a handjob sex? How about a blowjob? Cunnilingus?

You say you had sex with someone, 99.9% of people assume intercourse. You say someone is part of Rape Culture, and 99.9% of people (not on campuses) think you're involved in or somehow associated with a horrible criminal act.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

Again, you say this because you ignore the things they have said.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

this right here is a post really ripe for a whiff, or maybe it was unintentional?

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

You're a cis male if your gender identity matches your gender assigned at birth. If someone mentions it in connection with your ignorance, they are offering it as an explanation for why you are ignorant. It's only an insult if you think your gender identity means you don't need to think about the experiences of others.

Rape culture is not a group. It's a phenomenon.

Yes, just like "male bonding culture" except rape culture is a concept that's actually been pretty well described. You just haven't read about it.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

They're free to use their terms, and I'm free to be a crotchety old traditionalist, looking down my nose at them.

Fuck 'em. I also don't like ending sentences with prepositions.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

I don't know that I've ever heard anyone say an person is part of rape culture, versus that person's behavior, attitude or argument.

I mean, I'm sure it happens but it's not really what the concept is about.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

I've not been watching. Kindly cite me the quotes where they advocate for more rape and light treatment of rape.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

Oh, I see. When someone says somebody is complicit in rape culture, he only means the person's behavior, but not the person, is culpable.

I didn't rob the bank, Judge. That was just my actions. Jail them.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

I don't. And they don't have to think about mine.

When did empathy become the most important of human virtues?

Our only duty to each other is tolerance. The idea we all have to learn about others' experiences and empathize with them all is silliness. The only thing we must do is leave each other to live as we feel like living. In other words, leave your trans neighbor to live as the person likes, and don't try to inflict your views on this person. And vice versa. If you want to empathize, great. But it's not an obligation.

A culture is comprised of people. Rape Denial is a phenomenon.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

Yes, dude, and this isn't the first time you've failed to see that these things are more than personal insults.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

You do if you don't want to be an asshole. Obviously, this is not an issue for you.

Whenever humans first evolved to live in societal groups instead of individually.

You, as a cis white male, cannot do this without reckoning with how the inherent advantages you enjoy do not apply to others and, in fact, your identity prevents others from living how they feel like living.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

I don't see much sign that you've read the ones previously provided, so, yeah, go educate yourself.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

I rescind calling you unserious. You're card carrying nuts.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

You've convinced me. I'm going to go rob that bank.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

Your head is in the sand and you like it that way.

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

You're looney tunes, dude. Totally fucking looney tunes. My existence is the cause of others' disadvantages? Look, I get the concept, but that statement? That's exactly the kind of thing that can only said on a campus. You can't say shit like that in reality, in a room filled with rational, pragmatic people. People would whisper under their breath, "Who's your crazy friend?"

Re: Catholic boys start much too late.
 

What's important to you about words like "white privilege" "cis male" and "rape culture" is how they make you feel. Or how they make people to whom they apply feel. That's seriously fucked up.

Oh, right, you've no obligation to think about how they affect people to whom they don't apply (or apply differently), because that would be empathy, which is a thing that only crazy people do.

Strangely, you can grasp the criminal justice system generating unfair outcomes, but you also bristle at "racism" involving anything other than outright, expressed animus. Why do you have empathy for the unjustly imprisoned, but not for the unjustly withheld from opportunity? Is it first hand experience with the system, thus giving you a proximity you don't have on other issues. Or is it just the obvious involvement of the state (which is harder to see in other contexts)?