Quote:
Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield
I agree with that. But 17 isn't Junior High. That's sophomore year in HS. I'd already had sex by then. So had half of my friends. Two observations on that:
1. Yes, a lot of people having sex early wind up screwed up. But not because they had sex early. Because they came from screwed up backgrounds. Correlation, not causation.
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I'm specifically not talking about people who have just had sex young. I'm talking about young boys who had sex with adult women.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield
Those additional facts make the story a lot more seedy. And I never said she wasn't screwed up. I said it could be argued she deserved a pass. I did not state that this "pass" could be partial. I believe it can be. I believe if she was abused, her punishment should take that into account. I base this on studies I've read linking childhood abuse to proclivity to abuse as an adult.
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We are talking past each other on this point. I'll drop it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield
I understand what you're saying and do not think it applies.
They shrug it off sober because they think they'll be seen as seedy. Drunk, they'll laugh about it. I've saw a female friend bust one guy's ass about it just last year and he laughed and responded "sshhhh..."
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I obviously wasn't in the room. But the fact that you said that they think it's "seedy" and don't want to talk about unless they're drunk seems important, especially since men typically don't want to talk about issues they have--especially ones of a sexual nature. But whatever. Your take on your anecdotal evidence doesn't persuade me much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield
I was responding to this line from you:
I wouldn't be surprised if they weren't often completely screwed up. It's either abuse or it's not. We don't say, "That girl shouldn't complain. The dude who took advantage of her is an athlete!" You were the one raising the analogy of an athlete taking advantage of a girl. Is there a way to consensually take advantage of someone? I was just following the analogy and noting why, physically, it's a lot different than the Argento situation. |
No. You read a bunch into the hypo that isn't there. All I did was switch the sexes and pick a physical specimen that our culture finds attractive.
I assume the Argento encounter was consensual. The fact that we are talking about it at all is because she is deemed (by law and by most people's casual standards) to have taken advantage of a 17 year old boy. I didn't say anything about an athlete forcing himself on anyone.
The reason why we're talking about this topic at all is because if you are underage, you cannot consent to sex with an adult. Period. If a 15 year old girl wants to have sex with Derek Jeter (and I'm not sure why you turned the hypo into a football player forcing himself onto a tiny cheerleader) and he does it, he has taken advantage of her.
TM
