Quote:
Originally posted by mmm3587
I spend a lot more time around affluent minorities than I do around poor white people. And I do spend a lot of time in places where there aren't many white people. I play soccer in a Spanish-speaking league. My favorite local restaurant is mostly full of American blacks, and I spend at least one night a week hanging out at the reggae place down the street from me, which is about 90% Jamaicans. That said, it's not really relevant to this discussion (It's more of a Jerry Springer-esque, "You don't KNOW me!"), except to suggest that I don't spend all my time hanging out with the partners at my firm talking about favorite cuts of steak and how to keep minorities down.
That's about the most ignorant shit I've ever heard on the internet. You're obviously speaking somewhat facetiously, but your perception that those who are unlike you in racial makeup are sitting around conspiring to get you speaks volumes about your own pysche.
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It doesn't matter what I write. You translate it all into something else your screwed up little head thinks it should read.
I never once mentioned that you sit around conspiring to get me, you nitwit. My example was supposed to get you to recognize the things you must do when you're with your jamaican friends or whoever that allow you to feel accepted and trusted by them. Some of these things are what makes you you (although I'd love to meet these guys because I can't see how they could like you and if you printed out all your posts and presented them to them, I doubt highly they would continue to like you, but that is neither here nor there). Some of these things are bits and pieces of them and
their culture that you either conciously or subconciously try to get them to notice you have.
As for "ignorant shit" you've read on the internet, I doubt that highly. But if you want some really good stuff, just go back over what you've already written.
Quote:
Originally posted by mmm3587
Am I denying racism? No. I'm not denying that you've experienced racism, either. And I've never denied that certain minorities, as a group, suffer from racism and the perceptions and faults of society more than white people, as a group, do. But, for many Americans, their troubles are not based in their race. They don't have no health insurance, or no education, or no chances to live a comfortable life, because of their race. They have those problems because of other social and governmental problems in our country. Do minorities and women suffer from these problems more than white guys do? Yes, unfortunately, they still do. But the problems in the lives of people do not begin and end with race.
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Who the fuck said they did? Not me. I'm trying to live my life dealing with these problems. Where are you coming from with this "lives of people do not begin and end with race" bit? It sounds like you have a problem with race that's larger than mine because I think you're bringing some outside issues of your own here (that don't fit) and trying to force them into this conversation. At least my issues fit the topic.
Quote:
Originally posted by mmm3587
And in changing the lives of people for the better, I don't feel that segregation and exclusion are the answers. I feel strongly that affirmative action programs in admissions and even hiring are appropriate. But, as I understand it, it's still illegal to give extra "points" because of race, or hire someone solely because he or she is part of a certain demographic. And I think it should be.
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Again, what are you talking about? You are off-topic and I'm not going to get into a debate about what is and isn't affirmative action. Our conversation is limited in scope to the complaint you raised about what you weren't getting. Nowhere in any of these discussions has anyone raised getting extra points because of race or hiring someone because of race or gender. Oldest trick in the book. When you're losing and have nothing to say, shift the argument to one where a bunch of people will jump in to get your back. "Quotas are unfair!" Too bad we're not talking about that, jackass.
Quote:
Originally posted by mmm3587
We've got to recognize that those who benefit from these programs, especially in, for example, prestigious law schools and law firms, are usually pretty divorced from the problems that currently face the rest of their protected class. And by drawing (what I feel to be, in a modern law firm) arbitrary lines about race (invite that guy, he's an affluent Jordanian whose family owns half of the filling stations in New Jersey, but don't invite that guy, he's a poor Jew from Omaha) when determining who gets to be a part of a certain program offends me. Just like it offends me when the culture of a law firm dictates it's appropriate for a woman to sculpt her career to work around her kids and her family, but it's in appropriate for a man to want to be around his children.
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You're all over the place. Stick to what we were talking about or shut up. If you want to argue with dtb about how unfair it is that men are looked down upon if they take paternity leave, do it in another post.
Quote:
Originally posted by mmm3587
So, that's all. You're the one who's making the assumptions about me. The only assumption I've made about you is that your position in life is better than most black males your age. That doesn't seem far fetched. If true, it doesn't preclude you from feeling angry about racism or about wanting to have programs which, in your perception, will help to make our society racism-free.
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Don't ignore what I wrote and then try to sum up my ideas and opinions in such a simple, glib way. The simple fact is, most white people who give a shit about not receiving a mentor under plans like this don't really want a fucking mentor anyway. In fact, my firm had a mentor program for every incoming associate and did away with it because no one used it. I bet if you worked here, you wouldn't have either. But you would still be posting about how unfair it was if they instituted a minority mentoring program (which they haven't). You're talking out the side of your neck and we all know it.
Quote:
Originally posted by mmm3587
I don't think that benefits and programs directed only towards certain races are appropriate. I never have, and I never will. Even if they were, I don't think that that are likely to achieve the end that we're looking for.
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So just shut up, then. They're not hurting you. You're not missing out on anything.
Quote:
Originally posted by mmm3587
You're putting words in my mouth when you suggest I was saying you were going to get a bunch of black people together and jump me.
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I see. I guess I was going to "plot" (your word) by myself then?
Quote:
Originally posted by mmm3587
But you're the one who threatened violence, and that pisses me off, too. My protestations and statements automatically become racism, and then they automatically become worthy of violent retribution. Even with all the things you've claimed that I've said, or claim that I do, or claim that I am, it amazes me that you think an answer to the attitudes you perceive me to have is to try to threaten me and intimidate me over the internet.
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I didn't threaten you. I said, "
If we met
and you said those things to my face I would beat your ass." We both know that's not going to happen, so go change your underwear and relax. I know you only get brave like this because we're separated by the internet.
And it's apparent you didn't read what I wrote this morning in response the first time. It was a way of demonstrating the difference between when you get offensive and when someone like Sebby does. I would shake my head and laugh at Sebby over a beer. After hearing what you said in person, I would be tempted to knock you out. But I'm not threatening you, so stop cowering.
TM
