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Old 06-11-2004, 04:55 PM   #211
notcasesensitive
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Quote:
Originally posted by Atticus Grinch
You have been wrong all this time. "Somers's" is correct. The only non-plural possessives entitled to use the "ess apostrophe" order are "Moses" and "Jesus," and even then it's purely tradition, not grammatical authority. See Strunk & White.

This is a pet peeve. So many lawyers think the "ess apostrophe" goes with any word ending in "s" and not just plurals. The rule says "plurals ending in 's'," and words have meaning, people!
Learn something new... I don't think I would have offended you, in practice, because my typical reaction is to just reword so that possessive is not required when there is a name ending in S.
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Old 06-11-2004, 04:57 PM   #212
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Originally posted by notcasesensitive
Fortune magazine published an article about Suzanne Somers and her thighmaster riches. My question is: is "Somers's" really the preferred possessive for her last name? I would have gone with "Somers'" but maybe I've been wrong all this time.
We had quite the discussion regarding this late one night on the plural possessive ending in S. I said it's Somers' thighmaster. Someone else (senior to me) said it's Somers's. I was always taught the former. I went to an impartial juror and she said the NYTimes (or was it the LATimes?) book of style says my way is correct. Senior person quoted from "Woe is I" to show that she was correct. So - depends on who you reference. I say Somers'.
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Old 06-11-2004, 09:25 PM   #213
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Quote:
Originally posted by Atticus Grinch
You have been wrong all this time. "Somers's" is correct. The only non-plural possessives entitled to use the "ess apostrophe" order are "Moses" and "Jesus," and even then it's purely tradition, not grammatical authority. See Strunk & White.

This is a pet peeve. So many lawyers think the "ess apostrophe" goes with any word ending in "s" and not just plurals. The rule says "plurals ending in 's'," and words have meaning, people!
Right you are, Atticus. I will share with you another pronouncement from my 8th grade English teacher (Mrs. Bickley) that she would repeat to help us remember the rule:
  • I don't care how many "esses" are at the end of a word; if it's a possessive, it gets apostrophe + s. (The example she always used was "the glass's rim".)


Also, you can look up accounts of the late Lady Diana Spencer's untimely death and the subsequent funeral arrangements etc., and you will see that news stories write of "the princess's funeral" (or what have you).
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Old 06-11-2004, 09:28 PM   #214
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Quote:
Originally posted by NotFromHere
We had quite the discussion regarding this late one night on the plural possessive ending in S. I said it's Somers' thighmaster. Someone else (senior to me) said it's Somers's. I was always taught the former. I went to an impartial juror and she said the NYTimes (or was it the LATimes?) book of style says my way is correct. Senior person quoted from "Woe is I" to show that she was correct. So - depends on who you reference. I say Somers'.
It might not surprise you to know that I have a copy of "Woe is I" on my desk at work (along with a host of other grammar manuals and style books -- I know, you're all shocked...).

However, I don't know what the LA Times book of style says, but I can assure you that the NYT wrote about "the princess's casket" or "the princess's funeral" etc. when Diana Spencer died. I remember noting it, and feeling great relief that at least the NYT still had some standards.
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Old 06-11-2004, 09:44 PM   #215
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Quote:
Originally posted by dtb
Right you are, Atticus. I will share with you another pronouncement from my 8th grade English teacher (Mrs. Bickley) that she would repeat to help us remember the rule:
  • I don't care how many "esses" are at the end of a word; if it's a possessive, it gets apostrophe + s. (The example she always used was "the glass's rim".)


Also, you can look up accounts of the late Lady Diana Spencer's untimely death and the subsequent funeral arrangements etc., and you will see that news stories write of "the princess's funeral" (or what have you).
Ms. Binkley was wrong? If plurals are s' then princesses' is right, right? why would she say esses don't matter?
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Old 06-11-2004, 10:04 PM   #216
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hank Chinaski
Ms. Binkley was wrong? If plurals are s' then princesses' is right, right? why would she say esses don't matter?
I can't believe I'm posting here, but what the heck. I think either way is correct, just so long as you are internally consistent. Purists (or the British) may insist on "princess's", but "princess'" should be fine too.

In any event, if Hank can respond on this board, I sure as hell can.

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Old 06-14-2004, 11:26 AM   #217
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hank Chinaski
Ms. Binkley was wrong? If plurals are s' then princesses' is right, right? why would she say esses don't matter?
If we're moving on to plural possessive:

Congress. Is the word plural (in the British tradition of a collectivity as plural--"Man U are knackered out on the pitch"), and therefore:

Congress'

or singular, and therefore:

Congress's
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Old 06-14-2004, 11:29 AM   #218
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Originally posted by Mmmm, Burger (C.J.)
If we're moving on to plural possessive:

Congress. Is the word plural (in the British tradition of a collectivity as plural--"Man U are knackered out on the pitch"), and therefore:

Congress'

or singular, and therefore:

Congress's
Wouldn't your "British" characterization of treating the a collective noun as plural kind of answer that question? Of all things to treat as Brit. . . .
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Old 07-15-2004, 06:01 PM   #219
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hank Chinaski
Ms. Binkley was wrong? If plurals are s' then princesses' is right, right? why would she say esses don't matter?
God, I can't believe I missed this!

If you're talking about more than one princess, then yes, that would be correct (e.g., "the princesses' brother" or "the princesses' tiaras").

Mrs. Bickley was never wrong.
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Old 08-01-2004, 02:41 AM   #220
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Cheeeeeeese.

I have to admit to another longtime mispronunciation, of which I was reminded tonight. My only defense is that I'd only heard it correctly pronounced once, and was so certain it was wrong that I looked it up. To my shock, the misprounication I was seeking to disprove was actually a long-lost correct pronunciation.

Incorrect: Mars-CA-pone.

Correct: MAS-car-pone.
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Old 08-01-2004, 08:11 PM   #221
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Cheeeeeeese.

Quote:
Originally posted by Atticus Grinch
I have to admit to another longtime mispronunciation, of which I was reminded tonight. My only defense is that I'd only heard it correctly pronounced once, and was so certain it was wrong that I looked it up. To my shock, the misprounication I was seeking to disprove was actually a long-lost correct pronunciation.

Incorrect: Mars-CA-pone.

Correct: MAS-car-pone.
Many of your faux pas could be avoided if you'd only PM me for clarification first. dtb was considered poorly educated before she started.
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Old 08-01-2004, 09:49 PM   #222
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Cheeeeeeese.

Quote:
Originally posted by Hank Chinaski
Many of your faux pas could be avoided if you'd only PM me for clarification first. dtb was considered poorly educated before she started.
This was a unique situation --- I couldn't wrap my brain around the possibility that something so good could rhyme with NASCAR-moan.
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Old 08-06-2004, 03:52 PM   #223
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From the NY Times!!! (not that surprising, actually)

Quote:
VOWS
Bex Wallison and Chris Hufferdine
By LOIS SMITH BRADY
For many couple's, it's an important sign of kinship to have unusual things in common. These two share broken bones and rugby.
Let's see how long it takes them to fix it.

I'm sure it's just pure luck that they got the "it's" right.

Last edited by robustpuppy; 08-06-2004 at 03:56 PM..
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Old 08-06-2004, 03:58 PM   #224
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From the NY Times!!! (not that surprising, actually)

Quote:
Originally posted by robustpuppy
Let's see how long it takes them to fix it.

I'm sure it's just pure luck that they got the "it's" right.
they've fixed it in the story, but not in the headlines section. I have to admit that when I saw the names and the rugby references, I was really hoping it was a same-sex wedding announcement. Bex?
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Old 08-30-2004, 06:06 PM   #225
Atticus Grinch
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Calling Miss Punctuation

Road sign now properly punctuated to avoid offense.
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