We are all Slave now.

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally Posted by greatwhitenorthchick

Here's the thing:

Ontario (where I'm from) just elected as premier a Trump in Canadian form. He rode to victory promising cheap beer (seriously). He's Rob Ford's (remember him?) less classy and more white nationalist-y brother. (So on a private note, Fuck you Ontario, and especially fuck you Peterborough -- that's the place in the sticks where I am from that went all in for Ford.).

So my point is that things are just as fucked there as they are here. Educated v. not educated, urban v. rural divide, white assholes etc.

And Quebec has always been slightly fucked up. In Quebec City at least, they tend to like Americans better than English Canadians, so you'll likely experience no issues at all there. Montreal is pretty chill overall, so I wouldn't worry there. And Tremblant is touristy, so no problem there.

Returning to my original point about Canadians hiding their feelings. We do it well and are pretty reserved. So even if you encounter anti-Americanism, it will likely be pretty muted.

Rob Ford's brother? Seriously. Wow. Here, we blame Sebby for Trump. Do you have a face for the Ford thing? (oh, and thanks for the break down)

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally Posted by greatwhitenorthchick

That's because we're pretty good at hiding our contempt.

Here's the thing:

Ontario (where I'm from) just elected as premier a Trump in Canadian form. He rode to victory promising cheap beer (seriously). He's Rob Ford's (remember him?) less classy and more white nationalist-y brother. (So on a private note, Fuck you Ontario, and especially fuck you Peterborough -- that's the place in the sticks where I am from that went all in for Ford.).

So my point is that things are just as fucked there as they are here. Educated v. not educated, urban v. rural divide, white assholes etc.

And Quebec has always been slightly fucked up. In Quebec City at least, they tend to like Americans better than English Canadians, so you'll likely experience no issues at all there. Montreal is pretty chill overall, so I wouldn't worry there. And Tremblant is touristy, so no problem there.

Returning to my original point about Canadians hiding their feelings. We do it well and are pretty reserved. So even if you encounter anti-Americanism, it will likely be pretty muted.

Between Brexit and Trump and Le Pen and various other right wing nationalists in Europe, it's not a uniquely American phenomenon. There has been a cosmopolitan elite consensus in the developed world since World War II that is now under attack, and is no longer shared.

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop

Between Brexit and Trump and Le Pen and various other right wing nationalists in Europe, it's not a uniquely American phenomenon. There has been a cosmopolitan elite consensus in the developed world since World War II that is now under attack, and is no longer shared.

my relatives are southern Italian. I know the last election seems to have resulted in an anti-immigrant new government. That I can read from the news, IN ENGLISH. But on FaceBook, my Calabrese relatives keep posting articles, that seem to say Calabria went against it, and that the rest of the country basically wants to kick us out. But I'm guessing because these are all in ITALIAN and I can't get a clue.

[Pretty Little Flower]

Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop

I'm just hoping the rest of the world forgives us for electing him.

I'm not sure I would even expect them to. There have been points where I was considering accepting the heartfelt and eloquent apology that I wrote on behalf of Sebastian for doing what he knows he did, but at this point, I'm beginning to think that ship has sailed.

[Greedy,Greedy,Greedy]

Originally Posted by Pretty Little Flower

I'm not sure I would even expect them to. There have been points where I was considering accepting the heartfelt and eloquent apology that I wrote on behalf of Sebastian for doing what he knows he did, but at this point, I'm beginning to think that ship has sailed.

First reports out of Singapore, and it sounds like Trump has a big WIN!!! Rocket Man has agreed to mediate the disputes between Canada and the US, provided we give him missile technology and Canada provides him with Uranium!

Watch those little globalist libs cry!

[sebastian_dangerfield]

Originally Posted by greatwhitenorthchick

Returning to my original point about Canadians hiding their feelings. We do it well and are pretty reserved. So even if you encounter anti-Americanism, it will likely be pretty muted.

Like burning down the White House? What's "exercised" look like? Carpet bombing Erie?

[sebastian_dangerfield]

Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop

Between Brexit and Trump and Le Pen and various other right wing nationalists in Europe, it's not a uniquely American phenomenon. There has been a cosmopolitan elite consensus in the developed world since World War II that is now under attack, and is no longer shared.

The consensus regarding free trade and cooperation is not under attack. Trump and Italy are "burn it all down" movements.

People will compete with each other to a point. When the losers in a system feel like they can't win, like they've no chance, they'll shift to a different strategy: Making others lose, too.

All wealth and status is relative. If a person can't beat his betters, he'll pull them down. Shit, our entire media industry runs on that concept. 70% of what's in print or on TV is devoted to destroying a successful person. (I'm not even touching the envy industry that's social media... that's a cesspool of nothing other than bullshitting braggarts, trolls, and sociopaths.)

Brexit's a little different. That's fear of immigrants who aren't assimilating as rigidly as expected.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield

The consensus regarding free trade and cooperation is not under attack. Trump and Italy are "burn it all down" movements.

You are wrong.

People will compete with each other to a point. When the losers in a system feel like they can't win, like they've no chance, they'll shift to a different strategy: Making others lose, too.

All wealth and status is relative. If a person can't beat his betters, he'll pull them down. Shit, our entire media industry runs on that concept. 70% of what's in print or on TV is devoted to destroying a successful person. (I'm not even touching the envy industry that's social media... that's a cesspool of nothing other than bullshitting braggarts, trolls, and sociopaths.)

Have you thought about putting these sentiments on greeting cards?

Brexit's a little different. That's fear of immigrants who aren't assimilating as rigidly as expected.

OK, professor.

[Greedy,Greedy,Greedy]

Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield

Like burning down the White House? What's "exercised" look like? Carpet bombing Erie?

Hell is living in a Michael Moore movie.

[Greedy,Greedy,Greedy]

Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield

The consensus regarding free trade and cooperation is not under attack. Trump and Italy are "burn it all down" movements.

You do realize this is Moron Word Salad with Self-Contradictory Dressing, don't you?

[sebastian_dangerfield]

Originally Posted by Greedy,Greedy,Greedy

You do realize this is Moron Word Salad with Self-Contradictory Dressing, don't you?

A consensus is an agreed upon view of something.

I don't think Italy or Trump are products of people no longer believing that trade and cooperation are good things over the long term. I think it's short term losers recognizing they are losers without a chance of changing their situations during their lifetimes saying, "Let's blow the game up."

The Trumpkins and Five Star folks agree with the consensus. They just can't make it work for their benefit. So they're seeking parity by bringing others down to their level.

If I can't win, I'll bring the whole house down around me.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally Posted by Greedy,Greedy,Greedy

Hell is living in a Michael Moore movie.

Where the only thing to eat is rabbit.

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop

Where the only thing to eat is rabbit.

Well, given your coastal myopia I understand your confusion. But the people of Flint had food in that fantasy, just no jobs, so they bred rabbits to sell. A fairly sizable city, where once GM left, the only job was selling rabbits, think about that. And that's roger's fault?- got it. In fact there was/is a lot still going on there.

And look, you know my surname. Fucking GM actually cheated my fam out of my birth right in about 1910 or so. I am no friend of that company. But MM's movies are silly fantasies. It made more sense when you were watching West Wing.

[Greedy,Greedy,Greedy]

Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski

Well, given your coastal myopia I understand your confusion. But the people of Flint had food in that fantasy, just no jobs, so they bred rabbits to sell. A fairly sizable city, where once GM left, the only job was selling rabbits, think about that. And that's roger's fault?- got it. In fact there was/is a lot still going on there.

And look, you know my surname. Fucking GM actually cheated my fam out of my birth right in about 1910 or so. I am no friend of that company. But MM's movies are silly fantasies. It made more sense when you were watching West Wing.

Just to be clear, I've always viewed pet/meat as a false dichotomy.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski

Well, given your coastal myopia I understand your confusion. But the people of Flint had food in that fantasy, just no jobs, so they bred rabbits to sell. A fairly sizable city, where once GM left, the only job was selling rabbits, think about that. And that's roger's fault?- got it. In fact there was/is a lot still going on there.

And look, you know my surname. Fucking GM actually cheated my fam out of my birth right in about 1910 or so. I am no friend of that company. But MM's movies are silly fantasies. It made more sense when you were watching West Wing.

I have nothing but sympathy for the people of Flint, especially if they are eating nothing but rabbit, but that does not mean I want to live their life. YMMV.