Poll: On the Road
 

Awww yeah. Peoria strip clubs are legendary. Not sure I'd stick around that strange town after dark though.

Also, what is that town on the Mississippi where Grant was from? Lots o Chicagoans swear its the prettiest place in Illinois. For the life of me though, I can't remember its name. Never been out that way myself.

Hello

Poll: On the Road
 

Make a point of stopping either in Taos or Santa Fe. Wander around the city centers. Head into a local-looking bar close to (but not on) the Plaza. Have a few and ask the bartender where they would suggest eating good northern mexican/new mexican food. Eat dinner there, particularly if it is a $2 burrito stand in the wrong part of town. It will ruin you for mexican food in DC forever, but it will be worth it.

If you've a taste for religious weirdness, between the two cities is the Santuario de Chamayo. There is a shrine in an old convent where the Virgin has appeared and worked miracles. It has been "discovered" and so the whole place is sort of a zoo now, but it is still worth seeing if you've an interest. The town also is famous for its fabulous weaving.

If you wind up in Santa Fe, be sure to have breakfast in the restaurant in the lobby of La Fonda (if you stay overnight in Santa Fe, stay there - it's not the fanciest hotel in town, but it is where one stays and has been since 1607). If you go to Taos, go to the pueblo, which has been continuously occupied for more than a thousand years. The spanish mission at Taos was established in 1589, and Santa Fe was was established by 1608 and made the capital of New Mexico in 1610, making them older than any east-coast european settlements other than St. Augustine in FL and, in the case of Santa Fe, Roanoke and Jamestown. Enjoy experiencing a bit of the invisible history of your country.

BR(and listen for the hum in Taos)C

A Sad Day for Chef
 

I'm beginning to think you might need a spanking as well. Don't know why... you just strike me as the sort who'd appreciate it.

Call me when you're in Philly... I have wooden stirring spoon that make a magnificent cracking sound.

S(or we can just argue about federal tax lien issues and let the sexual tension build to a frothier boil than it already is...)D

A Sad Day for Chef
 

While Kirsten's breasts are phenomenal, I see 15 girls on the street everyday who are better looking than her. Not that she's ugly. Just above-average and plain.

A Sad Day for Chef
 

Which street?

Poll: On the Road
 

The town is Galena. Never been there either. Hear it's nice, but it's not near anything...

Peoria = Big, as in Big John's BBQ and Big Al's, which draws every red-blooded American male from hundreds of miles around... BBQ, breasts and a Boat (of the gambling variety) all within a few blocks...

A Sad Day for Chef
 

Isn't this a variation of the "heart" invention discussion? I thought the "mainly correct" gem came from the genius known as Tripplehorne from his break-up email.

But, then again, maybe I'm not mainly correct. Wouldn't be the first time.

A Sad Day for Chef
 

Surprise, surprise, you don't get my point.

I'm not saying no one should take off their clothes. I'm not saying that the naked body isn't to be appreciated. It's like you can only hear your broken record (and yes, it's you with the broken record and the same cued-up response to any post with certain SD triggers in it) that keeps playing in your head.

What I'm saying is if you DO have certain principles, you don't have to sell them to the highest bidder. If your child was kidnapped and brainwashed and you live a comfortable life (financially speaking), it actually might not be a good idea to cash in on her story. She may be too young to make that decision for herself. You should be protecting her, not exploiting her. If she has a negative reaction to all of this (and her interview with Katie Couric is not the best example of what's going on in her head) down the road, you're a piece of shit, greedy motherfucker who took advantage of a horrible time in your family for some cash. That's an example of not necessarily having to take the money, take the money, take the money! Can you see it?

And Britney Spears may not be the best example because I think she's a whore for attention and money. (I also think that she's been made that way when she was very young and didn't have the sense to make her own decisions and let everyone make them for her -- now that she's older and is in a position to make some decisions, she thinks, like you, that the ones that bring her the most cash are the right ones.) But I also think she didn't have to take her clothes off. And the extra cash it gets her doesn't make a fucking difference. In fact, she expressed some regret after doing it. So, maybe it wasn't such a great idea, especially since she didn't have to to be one of the wealthiest people in the world.

And I'm glad you brought up Halle Berry -- perfect example. She sold out. She didn't want to take her clothes off. She hasn't her whole career. Why did she do it in Swordfish? $500,000. Did she need that extra $500,000? No. It was stupid. She should have waited for Monster's Ball where there was a reason for it. In Swordfish, she looked uncomfortable the whole time she was topless and it added nothing to the plot. And while I love looking at her naked breasts, I would not think she was any less attractive if she didn't show them to the world.

So, the point is, you don't have to sell out just because it will get you a bunch of cash. Cash doesn't necessarily equal happiness. Especially when you're already flush with it. Your principles don't always have to be for sale.

TM

Poll: On the Road
 

Agree re Nebraska generally, but not if you are talking about I-80, which follows the North Platte River. All around you is the prairie, but you wouldn't know it for the longest time because you are stuck in a little corridor of irrigated farmland. And the truck traffic is a drag. Better to pick a parallel state highway.

Mark Leyner describing I-80 in Iowa (as I recall):

corn
corn
corn
Stuckey's
corn
corn

A Sad Day for Chef
 

Michigan Ave. Interspersed among the fucking suburbanite shoppers...

Poll: On the Road
 

Speaking of Stuckey's, do they still have those things? When I was a kid on family road trips, those were the places to stop for a bathroom break, one of those travel bingo games, a hand dipped ice cream cone and a pecan log roll (NTTAWWT)...

Edited to add: Apparently they still exist, but IL has only one left.

All of the trademark blue pointy roofed buildings I see along IL interstates now are other gas stations or establishments selling porn to truckers (NTTAWWT either)...

For Dat Phan and Robust Puppy
 

I believe I invented this rant, but I have little hope that anything will change. The whomever's who are behind the Dat Phans, Daves, New Jerseys, Bil Mo's, Carol Merrills, etc. are no different from the people behind the old Lactation Lovers, Bilmore's Inner Cynics, or dozens of other forgetable wastes of photoresins.

The problem is, like 2nd Lieutenant Steven Hauk in Good Morning Vietnam (or that loser junior partner down the hall), they think they are funny and nothing you or anyone else says to the contrary will convince them otherwise.

SDs greatest hits
 

I have not found the post yet. BUt I am in the ballpark. And I Found this classic from SD (prefaces a bunch of bullets on point)

"Everyone knows the real reasons the sorts of chicks who rail against women with plastic surgery do so:"

A Sad Day for Chef
 

Wrong. I do.

I just think that since Brit apparently isn't much good for anything else, she might as well take it to the bank before she wrinkles.

A Sad Day for Chef
 

No argument here. And yez, she has fantastic breasts. That's why she was in the post. I never realized how beautiful they were until that scene in Spiderman. They're almost as nice as Jennifer Love Hewitt's.

TM

A Sad Day for Chef
 

I wish I could buy stock in 'J.Lo getting naked within the next 2 years'...

Poll: On the Road
 

Press on to Stuckey's

(with convenient interstate-locator service)

A Sad Day for Chef
 

I hope that wasn't sarcasm, because J. Love really does have some nice ones--and I think they're real. Too bad about the face, though. I always get the urge to yell "Giddy up!" and put on a cowboy hat when I see her. Perhaps those are just my issues.


http://www.djcl.com/cc/jenniferlovehewitt/logo4.jpg


Edited to add picture. Okay, not as horsey-face here. Maybe I'm wrong.

Whine about subject line deleted.

Poll: On the Road
 

Do any of the major east-west interstates not have sucky truck traffic, other than perhaps I-94 in the winter?

A Sad Day for Chef
 

She doesn't drink, gamble, party or whore herself around. She is utterly boring. She has dated someone as boring as herself (Carson Daly). Yet I am fascinated by her.

A Sad Day for Chef
 

No sarcasm. They're real and they're fantastic.

TM

A Sad Day for Chef
 

the press that someone would pay her 500K to take her top off gave her much more.........

A Sad Day for Chef
 

I got your point. Its very old. I think Joe Strummer made a fortune singing about it...

My point is that opportunity knocks very infrequently, and those who answer the door frequently have to bend a principle or two in doing so. I'm buyable to a degree. I won't lie, cheat or steal from a friend or an innocent, but if the cash is right, I'll make the most unbelieveable and equitably offensive arguments under the sun for a client. So will any other lawyer worth his salt because that's what we do. And it translates to business. I have yet to meet a businessman of exceptional success who didn't have to walk afoul of his conscience once or twice to get where he is. Its a fact of life that we all sell out a little bit to survive and succeed, and I think selling out by doing a nude shoot is rather minor. Of course, this is an uncomfortable truth that most of the myopic absolutists on the board can't stomach. I loathe moral absolutism because I find it offensive to rational intelligence. Even Atticus Grinch probably ran a stop sign from time to time... Britney's sin is hardly worth such vehement disgust and noxious self-righteous judgment. Her kids will never work because of her sacrifice, so I have a hard time believeing they'll be mentally scarred by her photos. In the pantheon of the foul things people do every day to get what they want, the moral shortcomings of a pop singer seem an utterly ludicrous target for ire. But maybe that's just because I can't seem anymore because I'm not as perfectly moral as the rest of the laudable idealists on this board. I say "God be with you" to all of those who can live in such black and white terms. I'd love to take a pedestal for myself, if only it were possible.

Poll: On the Road
 

through Pa take I-80 (or is it 90?) instead of the turnpike. it is much less crowded, and scenic, for an interstate

A Sad Day for Chef
 

Because if she didn't take off her top, the press that someone would pay her 500K would no longer exist?

TM

Poll: On the Road
 

I-80 is much worse than I-90, IMHO.

Poll: On the Road
 

I've made the drive from Texas to California a few times, sometimes alone, sometimes with others. I've probably driven from Texas to New Mexico forty or so times in the last ten years. I know that part of the trip rather well. I'm assuming that you will be driving I-40. This is a good route.

When you hit Amarillo, the Big Texan steakhouse will be on your right as you drive into town. It's a cheap ass tourist trap, though if you're into cheesiness, you may want to check it out. I can't say the food is any good, but I don't really have any recommendations for Amarillo cuisine. When you get out of town on I-40, on your left, maybe a mile or so after the feedlot, you'll find the Caddilac Ranch. Some guy burried the noses of ten Caddilac's, in a row. They've been there forever, and there's a place where you can pull over and park and walk up to them. There's quite a bit of graffiti on the cars.

Maybe 100 or so miles down I-40, you'll hit Tucumcari, New Mexico. If you have time for a breathtaking detour, exit at the first sets of hotels (I think the road is called Tucumcari road or something like that) and stay in the right lane. You'll be on a road full of motels and diners. When you hit the light at highway 104 (maybe a mile or two after you exited), take a right. For about 100 miles, you'll be on a two lane highway, and there's sort of a speed trap for the first five or so miles. Maybe another 20 or so miles down the road, you'll pass a little estuary where people will take their boats, and then after that, your speed will be entirely up to you and the occasional car you'll pass along the way. It's a spectacular drive, one of my favorites in the country. The views are fantastic, and the sky seems almost a deeper shade of blue. There's practically no one living around there, maybe a few cattle ranches, and a lot of sage brush. At about 75 or 80 miles, you'll be at the base of a mesa, and you'll have to slow down it to climb up about 1000 feet. Once you're on top, the land will be totally flat, and totall different than what you just left. It's amazing. You'll be coming very close to the Sangre de Cristo Mountains that you saw in the far distance from I-40, and you'll finally end up in Las Vegas, New Mexico. It's a very cute little town, and there's a fairly good diner right as you get into town. You'll cross over I-25, and hit a stoplight. Turn right, and you'll see the diner maybe half a block down the road. You can wander around town a bit, and check out the little college, and the kick ass train station, or you can can head straight to Santa Fe. Santa Fe's not that far away, maybe an hour down I-25 South.

If you still have time and interest in wandering around, exit at St. Francis (road, drive, whatever), and go through a million stoplights until you see the signs for the Plaza, Governors Mansion, etc. at Cerillos Road. Turn right on Cerillos Road, and then left on Peralta. That's where all the touristy stuff is. Park when you start seeing stuff that's interesting. It's a very walk around type of place, and there are usually crowds. If you're there on the weekend, keep on going down St. Francis (which has probably changed names a few times while you've been on it, but it will be the same street) and enter onto US 84 heading north. Stay in the left lane when you see the signs for the Opera, and at the NEXT exit (after the Opera exit) , turn left. You'll be in a kick ass flea market. Be sure to haggle on prices. (Further north on 84, you can get to Los Alamos, Bandelier National Park, Espanola (the low rider capitol of the world) and Taos, but it doesn't sound like you have much time). To get back to I-40, you're going to just get back on I-25, and head south for an hour, and I-40 meets up with I-25 in Albuquerque.

From Albuquerque to the border, it's pretty, but fairly boring. You will be, for a good part of that time, in the largest reservation in the country. You may want to read a Tony Hillerman book along this route, but as far as I'm concerned, the next interesting thing is Flagstaff, and the turn off to the Grand Canyon. I've been to the Grand Canyon three times, and each of those trips was maybe a three or so hour stop, while I was driving either to or from California. I thought it was especially beautiful in the winter, and if I'm ever in the vicinity of the Grand Canyon, I'll stop.

SDs greatest hits
 

POST NUMBER 15838 (dont tell me someone else ffound it first)Ahem, BULLSHIT.

Everyone who's posted on this topic knows I'm mainly correct. The thing is, its an ugly truth that most plastic critics offer these high minded social/political reasons, but in fact simply dislike the perfect body image that society holds as a standard. They call the Holloywood body unhealthy. They rip on LFB. They rip on the thin, they rip on the altered, they rip on those with trainers. And when confronted with the fact that most of them are ripping because of insecurity, they hide behind the facade of "These plastic people are sad." I know a bullshit argument when I see one, and your argument, my dears, is mostly horseshit.

What you are all doing is trying to disprove a largely truthful proposition that you find distasteful and upsetting. Rather than say "Hey, SD, we know you're largely correct, but its a foul truth you offer, so we'd rather not hear it," you all scramble for the wildest Rube Goldberg argument you can strap together to support your position.

Its a hell of a lot more comforting to deny that a position you dislike might be largely correct than it is to admit it and move on.

Say whatever you like. This argument ain't about society at large, McMansions, feminist politics, morals, etc.

As i said, I ain't 100% correct, but not one of you will even admite that I'm pretty much correct, despite the fact that you all know very goddamn well that I am. This is a really funny board.

S(maybe refusal to admit an inch is a lawyer thing)D


Last edited by sebastian_dangerfield on 07-30-2003 at 11:24 AM

Cynics, realists and idealists, oh my
 

Sure, we are all motivated by selfishness to an extent, but not strictly.

The different between a realist and a cynicist is one of extremes. The realist sits between the cynic and the idealist.

The cynic we've already defined. The idealist is one who doesn't allow practicalities to interfere with his conduct which is often unrealistic in expectations for reasults or his ideas which are often visionary to the point of implausability.

A realist or pragmatist on the other hand is well aware of the limitations of society, but not focused solely on the negative aspects therein.

I bet you most people have a little bit of all three hiding around inside.

A Sad Day for Chef
 

some sleezy Hollywood guy said "we have no scene where this fits in at all, but we'll pay you 500K to show your tits in Swordfish"

She says no, we never hear of the story unless she sits on Letterman telling the story, which would make her sound a shit.
no one hears because there's nothing to think about.
She says yes, the story comes up in the press about the fact she showing her tits, and why. people hear the story because they're thinking about seeing her tits, and realizing they have to see this movie now, even thought John Travolta makes them sick. and she becomes this actress whose tits are worth 500 for a brief glimpse. (or maybe she already knew she was going to show Billy Bob them in a few months so she should just take the 500)

SDs greatest hits
 

I am intrigued by the edit but due to idiocy still (STILL) cannot find this post.

Please let me know when you would like your 30 min of undying gratitude. I previously PMed as if it would start immediately but that does not seem fair.

SDs greatest hits
 

the fact that a search for "mainly correct" does not pull up this post makes me think I'm mainly correct that the search function sucks.

SDs greatest hits
 

You also cannot search "tour de force" bc de is too short. I think it would be easier to land your first role in Holloywood without taking your clothes off than find this post. Someone owed me some money for lost time.

SDs greatest hits
 

My search for Holloywood and rube do not pull it up either. Knowing the post number is just frustrating because there is no way to get there other than paging through about 300 pages (and I have my thing set so that the max # of posts appears on each page).

edited to note that I searched for "holloywood" and "rube" separately.

Poll: On the Road
 

I can offer info on Arizona and Maine. Haven't been through the other states yet.

Lots of great places to wander in Arizona. The Meteor Crater, Oak Creek Canyon, Route 66 through Oatman (don't hit the burros). Route 66 was hard to find, but worth it. Make sure you have a full tank of gas when leaving Kingman.

If you do detour through Maine, I've got lots of favorite places: Moody's Diner on Route 1 just south of Thomaston, the Prison Store in Thomaston, Rockport (and the Maine Photographic Workshops if you are a photography buff), The Bag at Sugarloaf.

SDs greatest hits
 

You, Paigow, and Burger need to stop your fucking whining.

(Don't) Carry On.

Even(love y'all!)Odds

Poll: On the Road
 

Mmmm. Pie for breakfast.

Poll: On the Road
 

If shopping is of interst, in Albuquerque stop by Gus Archuleta's place (Gus's something or other). Both touristy and really nice indian jewelry. He's also branched out into kachinas and some pottery, too, I think. Good deals to be had. Only thing worth seeing in Albuquerque.

SDs greatest hits
 

Oh, wah wah wah, skim. And none of us would be bitching at all (well, I probably wouldn't be) if we hadn't somewhat haughtily been referred to the search function as if that function would actually aid in a search for the post in question. Shouldn't that be "all y'all"? I feel unloved.