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-   -   You (all) lie! (http://www.lawtalkers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=848)

PresentTense Pirate Penske 03-25-2010 02:10 PM
Re: You (all) lie!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sidd Finch (Post 419957)
Do you actually know anyone who lives in the suburbs? Those people take appliance vandalism seriously. This is like stepping on Elvis's blue suede shoes.
As an aside, I have blue suede shoes. :)

Replaced_Texan 03-25-2010 02:58 PM
Re: You (all) lie!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThurgreedMarshall (Post 420003)
I tend to agree with you because people are stupid. Right now, I think Obama has lost a lot of votes from the middle. And that's mostly because people are completely uninformed and the right has done a better job of making HCR scary.
It's amazing how well they've done. I saw something today from an R leaning friend of facebook about how HRC violates the Constitution because "Congress exempted themselves from HRC". When I asked what she meant, she said that Congress gets to keep the healthcare they have. So I explain that EVERYONE with employer provided healthcare gets to keep the healthcare they have, and the only thing Congress did was change the menu of their own options from the five or six plans that the federal government negotiates to the menu provided by the Exchanges. I even gave her citations to the law rather than an article about the issue because I wanted to ensure that she'd not dismiss what's actually in the bill as being biased because the information came from a left-leaning media watchdog group.

I don't know what happened after that because I went to lunch and my friend deleted the post at some point. Five other people commented after I did, so I may have accidently started a flame war that I never saw, or others who know about the bill might have piled on. I wouldn't be surprised if by this time next week, we'll hear all sorts of muttering about Congress loopholing themselves out of HRC, even though the Federal Government provides health insurance for its employees.

My friend isn't an idiot. But she is getting riduclously bad information about HRC, and she hates it without having a real grasp of what's in it. I put about 60 percent of the blame on Democrats for not adequately explaining what is in the bill. The rest of the blame is shared by the Republicans and the Media.

Cletus Miller 03-25-2010 03:09 PM
Re: You (all) lie!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield (Post 419992)
I will keep unemployment high, and that's the only issue that matters.
Well, then, you just lost my vote. And I had such high hopes for the Sebby/Less 2012 ticket.

Hank Chinaski 03-25-2010 03:26 PM
Re: You (all) lie!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Replaced_Texan (Post 420019)
facebook
FB is horrible for politics. too many strands of everyones lives tied together. a lefty teacher in my school posted something about HC a few months back. One of his attaboy lefty friends wrote, "and the Rs aren't allowing the bill to be published, or on the net, so people can learn about it."

Okay, no commentary from me, i simply ask 1- how could they prevent the bill from being on the internet, and 2-what good would it do anyone to see it? unless you're a health care wonk it probably reads like 2000 pages of sanskrit.

well, pretty soon some ex-hippy grannies is yelling at me like a mad woman. she is calling me an evil no-gooder who assumes people are too dumb to understand the bill, blah blah blah.

i would not do anything near politics there.

PresentTense Pirate Penske 03-25-2010 03:34 PM
Re: You (all) lie!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski (Post 420025)
FB is horrible for politics. too many strands of everyones lives tied together. a lefty teacher in my school posted something about HC a few months back. One of his attaboy lefty friends wrote, "and the Rs aren't allowing the bill to be published, or on the net, so people can learn about it."

Okay, no commentary from me, i simply ask 1- how could they prevent the bill from being on the internet, and 2-what good would it do anyone to see it? unless you're a health care wonk it probably reads like 2000 pages of sanskrit.

well, pretty soon some ex-hippy grannies is yelling at me like a mad woman. i would not do anything near politics there.
2!! :)

ybff,

ptpp

LessinSF 03-25-2010 03:52 PM
Re: You (all) lie!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cletus Miller (Post 420022)
Well, then, you just lost my vote. And I had such high hopes for the Sebby/Less 2012 ticket.
Cool. I get to be the Veep and travel and say stupid things.

"Drunk and Drunker in the Dodecahed(onism)year. We'll Roll You a Twelve!"

sebastian_dangerfield 03-25-2010 03:55 PM
Re: You (all) lie!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski (Post 420025)
FB is horrible for politics. too many strands of everyones lives tied together. a lefty teacher in my school posted something about HC a few months back. One of his attaboy lefty friends wrote, "and the Rs aren't allowing the bill to be published, or on the net, so people can learn about it."

Okay, no commentary from me, i simply ask 1- how could they prevent the bill from being on the internet, and 2-what good would it do anyone to see it? unless you're a health care wonk it probably reads like 2000 pages of sanskrit.

well, pretty soon some ex-hippy grannies is yelling at me like a mad woman. she is calling me an evil no-gooder who assumes people are too dumb to understand the bill, blah blah blah.

i would not do anything near politics there.
I have no FB account and have no intention of ever getting one. (And when I view something online as a fucking cesspool, you know it's got to be bad...)

My wife, who drinks a lot of wine at night, got into an argument with a religious nut about abortion on FB. I keep telling her, "You're going to alienate a lot of people. Not because you're shitting on their religious views. Because you're speaking too logically" (Unlike me, she's maddeningly cold and pretty sharp in the way she analyzes and dismantles).

Anyhoo... The thread she was copied on was about 40 "attaboy" anti-Roe messages deep. Then she stepped in, on her third glass of vino, and crushed the pro-life ringleader. Politely, concisely, she made her case. The guy (a monk) fought back, but he got angry, got personal and made a fool of himself.

The problem is, now everyone on the thread, including many people in our area and in the greater community, undoubtedly think she's nasty, or a snob ("parochial" was one word used in her replies). Drag a man against his will to the bar, to work... to church, the barber or the doctor. Never drag him to logic with which he might not agree. You might as well be killing the son of a bitch. He'll see it, know it, and all the anger he can't muster against what he knows is reality, or sound reasoning, he'll aim at hating you.

So long as Facebook's full of humans I know who want me to know what they're thinking, and agree with it, I'll pass on putting my face there.

Greedy,Greedy,Greedy 03-25-2010 04:03 PM
Re: You (all) lie!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield (Post 420032)
I have no FB account and have no intention of ever getting one. (And when I view something online as a fucking cesspool, you know it's got to be bad...)

My wife, who drinks a lot of wine at night, got into an argument with a religious nut about abortion on FB. I keep telling her, "You're going to alienate a lot of people. Not because you're shitting on their religious views. Because you're speaking too logically" (Unlike me, she's maddeningly cold and pretty sharp in the way she analyzes and dismantles).

Anyhoo... The thread she was copied on was about 40 "attaboy" anti-Roe messages deep. Then she stepped in, on her third glass of vino, and crushed the pro-life ringleader. Politely, concisely, she made her case. The guy (a monk) fought back, but he got angry, got personal and made a fool of himself.

The problem is, now everyone on the thread, including many people in our area and in the greater community, undoubtedly think she's nasty, or a snob ("parochial" was one word used in her replies). Drag a man against his will to the bar, to work... to church, the barber or the doctor. Never drag him to logic with which he might not agree. You might as well be killing the son of a bitch. He'll see it, know it, and all the anger he can't muster against what he knows is reality, or sound reasoning, he'll aim at hating you.

So long as Facebook's full of humans I know who want me to know what they're thinking, and agree with it, I'll pass on putting my face there.
I think I'd like your wife. Maybe I'll friend her.

sebastian_dangerfield 03-25-2010 04:03 PM
Re: You (all) lie!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cletus Miller (Post 420022)
Well, then, you just lost my vote. And I had such high hopes for the Sebby/Less 2012 ticket.
High unemployment = better earnings!

If I hear that burned out cokehead Larry Kudlow say that one more time, I'm going to... Well, I'm not going to do much of anything. But I am going to get mad, and if I had his number, I'd call Kudlow and say, "Hey, asshole! You're on national fucking TV. I know you're an instant gratification kind of guy in a soundbite world, but by saying shit like that w/o adding the caveat that it's 'short term earnings,' and that in the long term, lack of consumption occasioned by high unemployment is going to tank that stock you're pushing, and the fucking market in whole, you're urging millions of dumb motherfuckers with more control over their portfolios than they ought to have to buy near the peak of a bubble! Shut the fuck up! Go on vacation until 2015. You made enough money with Cramer to do that. Get lost. Get a fucking healthy hobby. You look like the kind of douchebag who really needs a fucking girlfriend."

Atticus Grinch 03-25-2010 04:20 PM
Re: You (all) lie!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski (Post 419990)
i think they're hoping for some activist judges to throw out HC.
Can I get a whiffness?

PresentTense Pirate Penske 03-25-2010 04:31 PM
Re: You (all) lie!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield (Post 420032)
I have no FB account and have no intention of ever getting one. (And when I view something online as a fucking cesspool, you know it's got to be bad...)

My wife, who drinks a lot of wine at night, got into an argument with a religious nut about abortion on FB. I keep telling her, "You're going to alienate a lot of people. Not because you're shitting on their religious views. Because you're speaking too logically" (Unlike me, she's maddeningly cold and pretty sharp in the way she analyzes and dismantles).

Anyhoo... The thread she was copied on was about 40 "attaboy" anti-Roe messages deep. Then she stepped in, on her third glass of vino, and crushed the pro-life ringleader. Politely, concisely, she made her case. The guy (a monk) fought back, but he got angry, got personal and made a fool of himself.

The problem is, now everyone on the thread, including many people in our area and in the greater community, undoubtedly think she's nasty, or a snob ("parochial" was one word used in her replies). Drag a man against his will to the bar, to work... to church, the barber or the doctor. Never drag him to logic with which he might not agree. You might as well be killing the son of a bitch. He'll see it, know it, and all the anger he can't muster against what he knows is reality, or sound reasoning, he'll aim at hating you.

So long as Facebook's full of humans I know who want me to know what they're thinking, and agree with it, I'll pass on putting my face there.
If I join Facebook, can I friend her? ;);):o :) :D


eta: fuckshitgoddammit!! STP!! Merde!!

PresentTense Pirate Penske 03-25-2010 04:32 PM
Re: You (all) lie!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield (Post 420035)
You look like the kind of douchebag who really needs a fucking girlfriend."
Douchebag is last decade. It's colostomy bagge now. You got not the memo?

Tyrone Slothrop 03-25-2010 05:04 PM
Can we have a new conservative movement, please?
 
Bruce Bartlett:

Quote:
As some readers of this blog may know, I was fired by a right wing think tank called the National Center for Policy Analysis in 2005 for writing a book critical of George W. Bush's policies, especially his support for Medicare Part D. In the years since, I have lost a great many friends and been shunned by conservative society in Washington, DC.

Now the same thing has happened to David Frum, who has been fired by the American Enterprise Institute. I don't know all the details, but I presume that his Waterloo post on Sunday condemning Republicans for failing to work with Democrats on healthcare reform was the final straw.

Since, he is no longer affiliated with AEI, I feel free to say publicly something he told me in private a few months ago. He asked if I had noticed any comments by AEI "scholars" on the subject of health care reform. I said no and he said that was because they had been ordered not to speak to the media because they agreed with too much of what Obama was trying to do.

It saddened me to hear this. I have always hoped that my experience was unique. But now I see that I was just the first to suffer from a closing of the conservative mind. Rigid conformity is being enforced, no dissent is allowed, and the conservative brain will slowly shrivel into dementia if it hasn't already.

Sadly, there is no place for David and me to go. The donor community is only interested in financing organizations that parrot the party line, such as the one recently established by McCain economic adviser Doug Holtz-Eakin.

I will have more to say on this topic later. But I wanted to say that this is a black day for what passes for a conservative movement, scholarship, and the once-respected AEI.
It's the conservative movement is an unhealthy caricature of itself. I wish there were conservatives who thought it was time to fire the donors and find new ones.

Greedy,Greedy,Greedy 03-25-2010 05:06 PM
Re: You (all) lie!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by PresentTense Pirate Penske (Post 420037)
If I join Facebook, can I friend her? ;);):o :) :D


eta: fuckshitgoddammit!! STP!! Merde!!
Let's both friend her.

sebastian_dangerfield 03-25-2010 05:13 PM
Re: Can we have a new conservative movement, please?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop (Post 420049)
Bruce Bartlett:



It's the conservative movement is an unhealthy caricature of itself. I wish there were conservatives who thought it was time to fire the donors and find new ones.
Buckley had it right. He felt an obligation to debate with opponents and engage them, however ridiculous he felt their ideas were. Hence, crazy but articulate liberals like Mark Greene made numerous appearances on his show, and he gave them the floor and replied politely (save Vidal). Now, "conservatism" looks a lot like "tribalism" and "religion."

But thinking conservatism is not dead. Not by a long shot. Along with thinking progressivism, it's the big quiet middle.


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