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Greedy,Greedy,Greedy 03-30-2006 12:06 PM

Play misty for me
 
Quote:

Originally posted by baltassoc
Another anecdote that has informed my position on this issue: when I was in high school, I took a math class (precalc) in summer school to free up my schedule the next year. The class was desgined to allow students at the other high school, the honors high school, who had not started on the advanced math track to catch up and take calculus their senior year. I was the only one in the class who was not taking the class for this purpose, although not everyone in the class was at the other high school.
Everyone else in the class was black or hispanic. Everyone else in the class had essentially the same story: when they enrolled in junior high school, they were automatically placed in the lower track. The smartest kid in the class (who eventually ended up with a masters degree in math) was even put into remedial math initially, the standard class for students in the English as a Second Language class. The problem? He was a native English speaker and didn't speak any Spanish. But his last name was Lopez, and his parents weren't very good at fighting the system (luckily for him, a couple of years later a teacher took notice and ramrodded the school district into correcting its mistake).

That class was clearly a form of affirmative action. I had to fight to get into the class, as I wasn't the target. If it hadn't been there, Mr. Lopez wouldn't have had the prereqs to get into the math program he eventually got into (probably, with the help of an affirmative action program at his school). The summer program was only offered one year, though. The next year's students were just SOL.
When I hear stories like this, I'm just glad we passed the "No Child Left Behind" act. Obviously, the Republicans have long acknowledged that education and hard work are the way out of poverty, and have prioritized education the way no prior administration has.

Sidd Finch 03-30-2006 12:29 PM

Play misty for me
 
Quote:

Originally posted by baltassoc
Why do you think that? I didn't go to a defacto segregated elementary school until 3rd grade; I went to an elementary school that was just plain old skool segregated. As in no blacks allowed, regardless of where they live.

Yes, bussing was part of the desegregation solution. So were magnet programs. Anybody want to discuss the inherent racism in creating a plan to get more white students to go to a majority minority school by creating an honors program (which, in this case at least, backfired in spectacular fashion: from my class, every single student but one that participated in the magnet program was a minority. Social pressures among whites to stay at the other school were just too high.)?
It. Was. A. Joke.

Sexual Harassment Panda 03-30-2006 12:47 PM

Interesting campaign tactic.......
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Spanky
This guy is running against my candidate (Brian Bilbray) for Duke Cunningham's vacated seat.
Brian Bilbray is your candidate? The guy whose website front page says:
  • "Over the past several years I have served as a Co-Chair of the Federation for American Immigration reform (FAIR), working to convince Congress to toughen our laws against illegal immigration. We cannot wait one day longer to protect ourselves from illegal immigration and in Congress that issue will be my number one priority."

Doesn't seem like he'd be your guy, but hey.

Replaced_Texan 03-30-2006 12:54 PM

Interesting campaign tactic.......
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Sexual Harassment Panda
Brian Bilbray is your candidate? The guy whose website front page says:
  • "Over the past several years I have served as a Co-Chair of the Federation for American Immigration reform (FAIR), working to convince Congress to toughen our laws against illegal immigration. We cannot wait one day longer to protect ourselves from illegal immigration and in Congress that issue will be my number one priority."

Doesn't seem like he'd be your guy, but hey.
We're on our fourth day in a row of protests. I'm pretty impressed, though no one's sure what to do about all these kids who are walking out of school to march on city halls.

Not Bob 03-30-2006 01:02 PM

The Agenda
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Spanky
Sympathy for Guinier
By GEORGE F. WILL
Newsweek

. . . Just another day in the "reinvention of government" by a "New Democrat." What next? Next, this lot will "fix" the economy and "reform" the health care system. Hang on.

Copyright (c) 1993, 2005 Newsweek, Inc.
One out of two ain't bad.

Not Bob 03-30-2006 01:02 PM

Like thinking that Mexican busboys should learn to speak goddamned English!
 
Quote:

Originally posted by ltl/fb
Well, clearly that Lopez guy's parents just didn't care, and sins of the fathers, etc.
Exactly.

sgtclub 03-30-2006 04:44 PM

Interesting campaign tactic.......
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Replaced_Texan
We're on our fourth day in a row of protests. I'm pretty impressed, though no one's sure what to do about all these kids who are walking out of school to march on city halls.
I haven't kept up on this bill, but I'm curious to hear your objections. I take it you are not in favor of completely open borders, correct?

Replaced_Texan 03-30-2006 04:53 PM

Interesting campaign tactic.......
 
Quote:

Originally posted by sgtclub
I haven't kept up on this bill, but I'm curious to hear your objections. I take it you are not in favor of completely open borders, correct?
Objections to what? There are a lot of bills floating around.

I'm most in favor of something similar to what happened in 1986.

sgtclub 03-30-2006 04:58 PM

Interesting campaign tactic.......
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Replaced_Texan
Objections to what? There are a lot of bills floating around.

I'm most in favor of something similar to what happened in 1986.
To the concept of border security in general. I'm under the impression that 1986 was just amnesty for people already here but did little for border security.

Replaced_Texan 03-30-2006 05:06 PM

Interesting campaign tactic.......
 
Quote:

Originally posted by sgtclub
To the concept of border security in general. I'm under the impression that 1986 was just amnesty for people already here but did little for border security.
"Border Security?" That's what they're calling it?

Ok...

Last I checked, the border that has historically let terrorists through is the northern one, but that really didn't seem to be the focus in Congress last week, and it certainly wasn't why high school students all over my city are protesting.

Greedy,Greedy,Greedy 03-30-2006 05:14 PM

Interesting campaign tactic.......
 
Quote:

Originally posted by sgtclub
I take it you are not in favor of completely open borders, correct?
Why not? I mean, have them come through metal detectors on the way, but why not let a couple million more Mexicans in? Why do you assume no one could be in favor of open borders?

sgtclub 03-30-2006 05:26 PM

Interesting campaign tactic.......
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Replaced_Texan
"Border Security?" That's what they're calling it?

Ok...

Last I checked, the border that has historically let terrorists through is the northern one, but that really didn't seem to be the focus in Congress last week, and it certainly wasn't why high school students all over my city are protesting.
That's what I'm calling it. I'm not focused on just our southern border - I'm concerned about both, plus the ports on the coasts. I don't think the bills only pertain to our southern border, but I do think it's rational for people to focus there because it is my understanding that more people cross the southern border illegally than the northern one.

sgtclub 03-30-2006 05:27 PM

Interesting campaign tactic.......
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Greedy,Greedy,Greedy
Why not? I mean, have them come through metal detectors on the way, but why not let a couple million more Mexicans in? Why do you assume no one could be in favor of open borders?
Boarders with metal detectors are not open.

There also has to be some order to the way our country is organized. How else do we determine who gets to vote, who pays taxes, who is entitled to government assistance, etc.

And stop playing devil's advocate.

notcasesensitive 03-30-2006 05:32 PM

Interesting campaign tactic.......
 
Quote:

Originally posted by sgtclub
That's what I'm calling it. I'm not focused on just our southern border - I'm concerned about both, plus the ports on the coasts. I don't think the bills only pertain to our southern border, but I do think it's rational for people to focus there because it is my understanding that more people cross the southern border illegally than the northern one.
I note that if we would just annex Canada and Mexico already, we would have a much smaller border to monitor. So it turns out Spanky was correct on the Mexico annexation argument. Maybe his politician of choice in San Diego County (Riverside County?) is only on stage 2 of the larger Annex Mexico agenda.

I'd support that. Hell, no more birth certificate/passport requirement for my somewhat regular Cabo trips. Sign me up.

Replaced_Texan 03-30-2006 05:42 PM

Interesting campaign tactic.......
 
Quote:

Originally posted by sgtclub
Boarders with metal detectors are not open.

There also has to be some order to the way our country is organized. How else do we determine who gets to vote, who pays taxes, who is entitled to government assistance, etc.

And stop playing devil's advocate.
Well, in my state, the two main sources of revenue are property taxes and sales taxes. Everyone, legal, illegal and otherwise, pays them. Lots and lots of citizens get the benefit of undocumented aliens tax dollars here, and they have ever since the border changed from the Red River to the Rio Grande.

Seems to me that most everyone came from somewhere else, and we didn't have too much of a problem before.

My grandmother's family sort of just moved from Mexico to Galveston without papers or documents or anything. No one swam across any rivers. No one hired a coyote to sneak them across. They just picked up an moved. Eventually someone suggested that my grandmother'd been married to my grandfather long enough that she could get her citizenship. I suspect that there was a country or two in the 20s whose citizenry hated us.

I'm not the best person to ask. I'm a Texan first and whatever country we happen to be in second. The border sort of moves around me, but I stay in the same place.


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