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-   -   Is Ted Cruz Satan? Discuss. (http://www.lawtalkers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=875)

sebastian_dangerfield 05-04-2016 11:56 AM

Re: Is Ted Cruz Satan? Discuss.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ThurgreedMarshall (Post 500783)
I am so sick of this "everything for free," "both sides appeal to the lowest common denominator," "social issues are just distractions," "it doesn't matter who gets elected," bullshit.

I was going to write a whole response, but it's a waste of time. Those that are reading your post shaking their head in disbelief (most everyone here) of how full of shit you are on almost everything you say don't need me to parse out the arguments showing that. And those who believe almost anything you wrote (i.e., just you) are too delusional to have a legitimate conversation with anyway.

So, cheers!

TM

I'm sure somebody will tell me where I'm wrong. But don't harbor the belief there aren't people who agree with a good bit of what I said. Understand, they know what'll come their way - most often from you - if they do. So they don't.

You may want to consider whether you hear all sides of a disagreement here, or whether the invective you offer in response to what you don't like doesn't help to create an echo chamber of your own views. It's just a suggestion. No response needed.

sebastian_dangerfield 05-04-2016 12:01 PM

Re: Cut the Bullshit
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Greedy,Greedy,Greedy (Post 500782)
Ah, Sebby, the Rs are the ones who give out stuff without worrying about paying for it. The Ds have been the party of fiscal responsibility since at least Carter. Consistently. Without exception.

Good point. Medicare Part D is an abomination I overlooked. And their corporate welfare is atrocious. But in fairness, the Ds are also all about the corporate welfare.

The Ds have been the party of fiscal responsibility. Totally irrefutable. But the point I was making is, the Ds also run the "we got your back" angle with voters. The pitch is always, "we'll protect you and the safety nets."

Pretty Little Flower 05-04-2016 12:02 PM

Re: Is Ted Cruz Satan? Discuss.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ThurgreedMarshall (Post 500783)
Those that are reading your post shaking their head in disbelief (most everyone here) of how full of shit you are on almost everything you say don't need me to parse out the arguments showing that.

This is not really fair. He was spot on about the "no horns in rock" thing.

sebastian_dangerfield 05-04-2016 12:05 PM

Re: Is Ted Cruz Satan? Discuss.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Greedy,Greedy,Greedy (Post 500781)
This is a false dichotomy.

If it starts and ends with your pocketbook, it's only being rational.

(Of course, I haven't seen the proof for Hillary raising taxes. I don't recall her saying anything of the sort. But she's not exactly trustworthy, so...)

ThurgreedMarshall 05-04-2016 12:16 PM

Re: Is Ted Cruz Satan? Discuss.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield (Post 500784)
Snowden? NSA? A more and more centrally managed economy? Government by policy wonks who are wrong more than right? An engineered series of soft economic landings, sold to an incurious public with manipulated data, inevitably driving us toward a two tiered society where the top 20% does exceptionally well and everyone else is fucked? A govt corrupted by regulatory capture run for the corporations by the corporations?

What you fail to understand (and I've said this a thousand times) is that there are very few actual choices given the trend of businesses consolidating and wealth moving upward to the pockets of a very few. Either we enact laws to check the rampant change of our system from moderate capitalism to super-capitalism (and that means regulation and the protection of unions from conservatives) or a level of redistribution via government programs (what you so ridiculously deem, "free stuff"). Unless you want to live in what would amount to India in the West or you are in favor of actual revolution where the poor eat the rich, that's it. Those are your choices.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield (Post 500785)
But don't harbor the belief there aren't people who agree with a good bit of what I said. Understand, they know what'll come their way - most often from you - if they do. So they don't.

Look, there's always a little bit of truth in what you say. But you swallow it with so much hyperbole and opinion you equate with universal truth that your posts coming out sounding like the ravings of a lunatic.

Your last sentence is so fucking ridiculous that I can't believe you even wrote it. If you think anyone on this board is avoiding agreeing with you because I will criticize them, you are a bigger knucklehead than I thought you were.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield (Post 500784)
You may want to consider whether you hear all sides of a disagreement here, or whether the invective you offer in response to what you don't like doesn't help to create an echo chamber of your own views. It's just a suggestion. No response needed.

I think it is amazing that people like you think that people who disagree with you cannot hear what you're saying. If I critique a point or dismiss it as silly, best believe it's being heard. The fact that you can't accept that I hear your points, understand them, and still think they're highly ridiculous is not me not listening. It's you not being able to accept that I think what you're saying is stupid.

TM

Pretty Little Flower 05-04-2016 12:27 PM

Re: Is Ted Cruz Satan? Discuss.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ThurgreedMarshall (Post 500789)
Your last sentence is so fucking ridiculous that I can't believe you even wrote it. If you think anyone on this board is avoiding agreeing with you because I will criticize them, you are a bigger knucklehead than I thought you were.

O.K., it's time for me to come clean about a few things. I am one of those that Sebastian refers to who comes up with his "opinions" and "beliefs" based on not wanting to get criticized by you. I'm scared of you. Truth is, I don't even like rap. I think it's stupid. But I can't say that on this board. Look what you did to ferrets. You run this board with a Trumpian iron fist. WHICH IS TOTALLY IRONIC.

Adder 05-04-2016 12:59 PM

Re: Is Ted Cruz Satan? Discuss.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield (Post 500779)
The Democrats promise more free stuff to the most uninformed of their rabble in the same way the GOP promises it'll "bring yurrr jobs back" to the dimmest of theirs.

First, nobody is as good at promising to bring yurrr jobs back as a lefty (see, Sanders, B.).

Second, the free stuff could happen if we had the political will. We just don't.

Quote:

(Those affluent Trump voters I described a few sentences ago? Tax voters. Republicans in self-interest only. If Hillary promised lower taxes, they'd vote for her. That's the GOP in a nutshell: An educated, self-interested minority matched with layers of the quasi-informed, on down to the absolutely deluded and hopelessly uninformed.)
What Trump has realized is that these people don't really matter. Nor do the Christian social conservatives or small government libertarians.

All of them are people who have just been lying to themselves about how popular their ideas are while actually getting to office on the back of Trump-ist racist, misogynistic, xenophobes. Having been out-played on that front, they are all powerless.

Quote:

Neither has a serious fucking clue or solution. So honestly, who gives a fuck who gets elected? I don't. I could pull either lever and feel just about the same.
Says the relatively affluent white man. Jesus man. Could you be any more selfish?

Adder 05-04-2016 01:02 PM

Re: Cut the Bullshit
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield (Post 500786)
Good point. Medicare Part D is an abomination I overlooked. And their corporate welfare is atrocious. But in fairness, the Ds are also all about the corporate welfare.

Dude. Wars are corporate welfare.

Greedy,Greedy,Greedy 05-04-2016 01:43 PM

Re: Is Ted Cruz Satan? Discuss.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pretty Little Flower (Post 500787)
This is not really fair. He was spot on about the "no horns in rock" thing.

Yeah, and some people think there are no bagpipes in Reggae, but you and I, we have been through that, and that is not our thing.

Greedy,Greedy,Greedy 05-04-2016 01:47 PM

Re: Seeking TM's Approval
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield (Post 500788)
If it starts and ends with your pocketbook, it's only being rational.

(Of course, I haven't seen the proof for Hillary raising taxes. I don't recall her saying anything of the sort. But she's not exactly trustworthy, so...)

Space cadet. I was pointing out that educated/well-healed voters are just as likely to be useless idiots as anyone else.

Take yourself, for example...

sebastian_dangerfield 05-04-2016 02:11 PM

Re: Is Ted Cruz Satan? Discuss.
 
Quote:

What Trump has realized is that these people don't really matter. Nor do the Christian social conservatives or small government libertarians.

All of them are people who have just been lying to themselves about how popular their ideas are while actually getting to office on the back of Trump-ist racist, misogynistic, xenophobes. Having been out-played on that front, they are all powerless.
There is no proof at all for this.

Quote:

Says the relatively affluent white man. Jesus man. Could you be any more selfish?
If Hillary were to offer a serious, detailed policy of criminal justice reform, I'd switch from undecided to her. But she won't. She loves the law and order, put-all-the-super-predators-away voters.

The best reason for me to vote for her is naked self interest. Shit's good, and she'll keep it good. For me, and you, and everybody here. Trump's the only candidate with any capacity to surprise. But will he? Doubtful. If elected, he'll likely be Nixon's third term. Which isn't much different than Obama was (abysmal on press freedom and domestic surveillance) and Hillary will be.

sebastian_dangerfield 05-04-2016 02:11 PM

Re: Seeking TM's Approval
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Greedy,Greedy,Greedy (Post 500794)
Space cadet. I was pointing out that educated/well-healed voters are just as likely to be useless idiots as anyone else.

Take yourself, for example...

Uh, reread.

sebastian_dangerfield 05-04-2016 02:12 PM

Re: Cut the Bullshit
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Adder (Post 500792)
Dude. Wars are corporate welfare.

Proving my point that Ds aren't much different than Rs on corp welfare. Because if you want war, Hillary's your candidate.

Greedy,Greedy,Greedy 05-04-2016 02:18 PM

Re: Cut the Bullshit
 
One of the things I'm really looking forward to in the coming days is seeing who gets to attack Trump for his mob ties. I'm betting De Blasio and Cuomo get in a pissing match over who gets to be the attack dog on this point.

sebastian_dangerfield 05-04-2016 02:20 PM

Re: Is Ted Cruz Satan? Discuss.
 
Quote:

What you fail to understand (and I've said this a thousand times) is that there are very few actual choices given the trend of businesses consolidating and wealth moving upward to the pockets of a very few. Either we enact laws to check the rampant change of our system from moderate capitalism to super-capitalism (and that means regulation and the protection of unions from conservatives) or a level of redistribution via government programs (what you so ridiculously deem, "free stuff"). Unless you want to live in what would amount to India in the West or you are in favor of actual revolution where the poor eat the rich, that's it. Those are your choices.
Which candidate is offering either of those options? You think Hillary's going to aggressively redistribute, or regulate? You do recall who sold the liberal wing of the Democratic Party down the river in the 90s, right?

It doesn't matter what I think, or you think, or how we vote. This country is already starting to look like Brazil. And neither candidate is going to radically alter it because the conventional wisdom is that such a societal split is the natural consequence of a shift toward a more globalized economy. And the moneyed interests driving politics don't want anything to change. Until the cost of foreign labor meets ours, we'll bleed. The only potential reset is a massive war, and I'm not even sure if that'd change much. (Oh, and tech's also eliminating jobs.)*

No candidate is offering a serious policy platform for saving the middle class except Sanders. And he's been marginalized as a kook.
___________
* What's ultimately needed is a full on global reconsideration of all of our economic systems to address a world in which fewer and fewer people are going to need to or be able to find work. But that's a Big Complex Conversation not even the smartest wonks would know how to initiate. And the developing world, for good reason, doesn't want to hear it (though China's reckoning with it right now, like it or not). They want to have their ascendance to a decadent Western culture before having to take their medicine.


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