Pepper sprayed for public safety.

[Greedy,Greedy,Greedy]

Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski

He didn't win by that much. Like every other President in my voting life Obama won not because of people who thought he'd be better, he won because of people who thought he'd be less bad.

Team rape did more harm to Romney than Romney did to Romney. He would have put moderate judges on the Court and would have backed away from the anti-abortion and antigay positions in a quick second. But the insanity of the R's drove too many people away. It's one thing when all that hate is buried, but you would have to have one economically tunnel visioned voter to have ignored all that bike this time.

While I agree with some of this, you should realize he never backed off, and even intensified, the anti-gay stuff in his time here. You may argue he did that to set the stage for the national races, but, you know, it was one of the few times as Governor it seems like he woke up and actually got excited about something.

He hates gay people more than many and perhaps most republicans.

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally Posted by Greedy,Greedy,Greedy

While I agree with some of this, you should realize he never backed off, and even intensified, the anti-gay stuff in his time here. You may argue he did that to set the stage for the national races, but, you know, it was one of the few times as Governor it seems like he woke up and actually got excited about something.

He hates gay people more than many and perhaps most republicans.

Fair point. I have no clue on gays, at this point I also am not sure what he could actually do to harm them from 1600, beside fan hate. But to me, the R's biggest fuck up is with women. The day Palin was nominated my daughter and my wife were both apolitical. The shit then and this time sickened and scared thm. My daughter drove 100 miles home to vote. the time before she wouldn't walk downstairs in her dorm to vote. My wife wouldn't have voted either time. There go two Obama votes both times. I'm guessing that carried into states where it mattered.

The Ds have some challenges coming up with the next election, but the biggest story will be if the R's can nominate someone who doesn't seem tied to the nut jobs. Romney was gov of Mass. That means he can at least play not nuts. He moved from that to convince the nutcases he was one of them. The R's can perhaps grab back the Hispanic voters but the first step is to get competitive with women.

[Adder]

Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski

He would have put moderate judges on the Court and would have backed away from the anti-abortion and antigay positions in a quick second.

The part of the blame that rest on him is that you might believe that, but I don't. And almost no one feels very confident that they know what he really thinks.

[Greedy,Greedy,Greedy]

Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski

Fair point. I have no clue on gays, at this point I also am not sure what he could actually do to harm them from 1600, beside fan hate. But to me, the R's biggest fuck up is with women. The day Palin was nominated my daughter and my wife were both apolitical. The shit then and this sickened and scared thm. Then my daughter drove 100 miles home to vote. My wife wouldn't have voted either time. There go two Obama votes both times. I'm guessing that carried into states where it mattered.

The Ds have some challenges coming up with the next election, but the biggest story will be is the R's can nominate someone who can nominate someone who doesn't seem tied to the nut jobs. Romney was gov of Mass. That means he can at least play not nuts. He moved from that to convince the nutcases he was one of them. The R's can perhaps grab back the Hispanic voters but the first step is to get competitive with women.

I'll give you that as the second step. First step, embrace sanity. That's the hardest hurdle they have. Note that Rubio made comments today playing up to the creationists -- that first step is going to be tough.

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally Posted by Adder

The part of the blame that rest on him is that you might believe that, but I don't. And almost no one feels very confident that they know what he really thinks.

In 2040 you'll vote for the Dem. what you think is meaningless, same with Ty, Ggg, sidd and T. As much as sebby and I bother you we're the only voters that matter on this board, I mean we don't matter because of where we live, but people like us in a swing state.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski

Team rape did more harm to Romney than Romney did to Romney. He would have put moderate judges on the Court and would have backed away from the anti-abortion and antigay positions in a quick second.

It's funny how many Romney supporters believed he was lying to someone else but not to them.

But the insanity of the R's drove too many people away.

Did you really think he would moderate the Republicans in Congress?

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski

I also am not sure what he could actually do to harm them from 1600, beside fan hate.

Not directly responsive, but what he did as Governor was not right.

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop

It's funny how many Romney supporters believed he was lying to someone else

It's funny how many dems believe Obama didn't lie too.

[Adder]

Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski

It's funny how many dems believe Obama didn't lie too.

It's not that people think Romney made overblown campaign promises. Everyone, including Obama, does that.

It's that the man is a Rorschach test. He's had almost every possible position on every issue, and which one he's taking right now depends on who he is talking to. Anyone claiming to "know" what he really thinks is telling you more about themselves than about Romney.

Which is why so many people (including people like Scott Sumner who should have supported him) feel they don't know where he really stands. Why multiple articles were published in the conservative media that argued for Romney because he wouldn't really do what he's saying he would do.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski

It's funny how many dems believe Obama didn't lie too.

Republicans said, I support Romney because I think he says he will do x but will really do not-x.

I don't know any Democrats who said that.

[Adder]

Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop

Republicans said, I support Romney because I think he says he will do x but will really do not-x.

I don't know any Democrats who said that.

To be fair, Democrats were too busy doing happy dances about all the gifts Santa Obama was going to give them.

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop

Republicans said, I support Romney because I think he says he will do x but will really do not-x.

I don't know any Democrats who said that.

I'm not a republican. I'm one of the few people on this board that put any thought into a decision, but thanks for playin!

[Not Bob]

Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski

In 2040 you'll vote for the Dem. what you think is meaningless, same with Ty, Ggg, sidd and T. As much as sebby and I bother you we're the only voters that matter on this board, I mean we don't matter because of where we live, but people like us in a swing state.

I think that the GOP is in a similar position to where the Democrats were not too long ago. The Vietnam War and the horrific events of 1968 broke the Democracy (I love using those old phrases and expressions); or, maybe more accurately, split the New Deal coalition so carefully crafted by the very smart men and women (Frances Perkins, holla!) who worked for FDR. The south was peeled away by Nixon's Southern Strategy and the working class white "ethnics" (like my father and my uncles) were disgusted by the anti-war left and the counterculture. It was no accident that in 1972 Nixon's minions said that the Democrats were the party of "acid, amnesty, and abortion." Not counting the post-Watergate election of Jimmy Carter in 1976 (and that was a close one), the Democrats didn't win a presidential election until 1992.

Anyway, my point is that the GOP is in a similar spot -- a candidate has to make it through a primary process that is controlled by social conservatives, and must take positions that make it more difficult to connect with the center in November. Some moderate Democrats got tired of this, and groups like the DLC and the PPI came into being. Sam Nunn, Al Gore and Les Aspin started talking up national defense issues in a way other than "no nukes." Welfare reform and free trade became viable political positions for Democrats to take in the late 1980s.

I think that GOP centrists will do something similar. The 2016 primaries will tell us.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski

I'm not a republican. I'm one of the few people on this board that put any thought into a decision, but thanks for playin!

I didn't say you were a Republican. You exhibited a behavior that a lot of Republicans also exhibited (I was thinking specifically of David Frum, but there were others), so I observed that Republicans did that. (I'm sure Romney voters who weren't Republicans did it more, since they tend to be more moderate and they had to convince themselves that he would govern as a moderate, not withstanding all of the conservative positions he took.)

Would love to see some of that thought reflected in some way here, but it's a lot to ask for.

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop

Would love to see some of that thought reflected in some way here, but it's a lot to ask for.

"Hate is a four letter word."

Popular liberal saying from the 80s.


Why do you stray from the dogma?

P.s. I cannot continue to try and educate you. I have a crowd to entertain.