Welcome back E/O, leagl and Fringey: no one say the name "Penske" 3 times in a row

[Adder]

Originally Posted by evenodds

Given that "western medicine" is using acupuncture and other techniques as part of an overall pain treatment plan, yes, you are talking out of your ass.

For a lawyer, you do not read very critically. There are some rather key qualifications in there that make clear the Mayo clinic is not making and claims about the effectiveness of acupuncture:

According to traditional Chinese medicine...

Most people who use acupuncture believe it improves their health...

The belief is that one way to unblock energy flow

And, of course, the key, "But Western-style medicine has found it challenging to design research studies to prove acupuncture's effectiveness."

Even if it were just a placebo affect, if it enables someone with debilitating pain to function, that would be a significant benefit.

Absolutely it would. There is nothing wrong with placebo, especially if nothing else has worked. But you probably want to try everything else that has had some statistically demonstrated success first.

The research indicates that it's more involved with brain chemistry

What research? If you had some, this would be a more interesting discussion.

[Adder]

Originally Posted by barely_legal

Is it better to choose medical treatment based on a post from somebody who has never gotten the treatment and knows nothing about it?

You're right, when I said "I"ve never tried it" and "I am clearly talking out of my ass" it was a subtle attempt to get everyone to do exatly as I secretly wanted, which is to finally kill off the acupuncture-industrial complex.

[1436]

Accupuncture will help to unclog very precisely placed clogged pores and homeopathy will cure mild dehydration.

Why isn't that enough for you?

[Pretty Little Flower]

Originally Posted by Adder

You're right, when I said "I"ve never tried it" and "I am clearly talking out of my ass" it was a subtle attempt to get everyone to do exatly as I secretly wanted, which is to finally kill off the acupuncture-industrial complex.

Scrap! Py!

You fucked the paralegal, didn't you. Good man.

[Flinty_McFlint]

Originally Posted by Adder

You're right, when I said "I"ve never tried it" and "I am clearly talking out of my ass" it was a subtle attempt to get everyone to do exatly as I secretly wanted, which is to finally kill off the acupuncture-industrial complex.

Wait, your secret reason for posting was to kill off the acupuncture-industrial complex? Shit, I thought it was because you wanted to remind us why you never get laid. I need to refresh my critical reading lawyer skillz.

[taxwonk]

Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop

With acupuncture, you can sing out of your ass.

Or, uh, so I hear.

In communist China, ass sings out of you!

[Pretty Little Flower]

Originally Posted by Flinty_McFlint

Wait, your secret reason for posting was to kill off the acupuncture-industrial complex? Shit, I thought it was because you wanted to remind us why you never get laid. I need to refresh my critical reading lawyer skillz.

Wow, we had completely opposite take-aways from his posts. I'm not sure I'm using the term "take-away" correctly, but it was fun using it anyway.

[Sidd Finch]

Originally Posted by Adder

Not the lone dissenting voice, although I haven't tried it myself, I am highly skpetical that there is anything other than placebo effect going on. But clearly I am talking out of my ass.

Define "placebo effect."

I had severe bone pain, from the orthopod wrenching my poorly-set leg back into alignment. Pain meds weren't enough. Several hours later (long after the pain meds would have worn off anyway), I went to the acupuncturist, got needles and some god-awful powdered herbs, and 20 minutes later the pain was gone.

Not better, gone. If you've dealt with pain meds, you know that's not what they do -- they just take the edge off and make you groggy. This was very different.

I was very skeptical too, before I tried it -- child of a doctor and all that. But I was desperate, so I tried at the urging of a good friend.

[dtb]

Originally Posted by barely_legal

Is it better to choose medical treatment based on a post from somebody who has never gotten the treatment and knows nothing about it?

One time, I was bashed into a wall when my horse threw me, and I went straight from the barn to acupuncture. I was hurting on the way in, and pain free on the way out. Placebo, schmacebo.

But even if there were no therapeutic effects, I would continue to go because it's so relaxing. Better than Xanax (not that I've ever had xanax, but I think it's some kind of sedative).

One acupuncture guy I see says it's most effective for treating back pain. Whatever -- I love it.

[Sidd Finch]

Originally Posted by barely_legal

If you've never tried it, and you don't have any information to base your opinion on, what is the point of even posting?

Yeah, really Adder. Take it to the PB. That's how we roll over there.

[Replaced_Texan]

Originally Posted by Adder

Not the lone dissenting voice, although I haven't tried it myself, I am highly skpetical that there is anything other than placebo effect going on. But clearly I am talking out of my ass.

You know, it's really, really not hard to confirm these talking out your ass posts on PubMed. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez

[Did you just call me Coltrane?]

Originally Posted by dtb

One time, I was bashed into a wall when my horse threw me, and I went straight from the barn to acupuncture. I was hurting on the way in, and pain free on the way out. Placebo, schmacebo.

But even if there were no therapeutic effects, I would continue to go because it's so relaxing. Better than Xanax (not that I've ever had xanax, but I think it's some kind of sedative).

One acupuncture guy I see says it's most effective for treating back pain. Whatever -- I love it.

Dalton said "pain don't hurt," and he had a PhD in Philosophy from NYU. Now, who do you think I'm going to listen to: you or Dalton?

[ThurgreedMarshall]

Originally Posted by Adder

For a lawyer, you do not read very critically.

You've always been a weenie, but when did you become such an insufferable weenie?

TM

[Pretty Little Flower]

Originally Posted by dtb

One time, I was bashed into a wall when my horse threw me, and I went straight from the barn to acupuncture. I was hurting on the way in, and pain free on the way out. Placebo, schmacebo.

I am not taking a position on acupuncture one way or another, but I am not sure your story actually debunks the possibility that there is a placebo effect with acupuncture.

[Pretty Little Flower]

Originally Posted by ThurgreedMarshall

You've always been a weenie, but when did you become such an insufferable weenie?

TM

It happened after he fucked the paralegal. This is Greedy's fault.