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Old 05-15-2019, 11:53 AM   #1741
Tyrone Slothrop
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Re: Doesn’t Matter Who Wins the K Race; We’re All the Same

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Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield View Post
I suspect her people also knew the server was an issue from the start.
Try to picture yourself suggesting that a Republican cabinet secretary like Mike Pompeo or William Barr should be criminally prosecuted for making decisions about how his department's servers should be configured. She was the fucking Secretary of State, and she was doing her job. The only way any of this ever becomes an issue is if you pretend that she is just some woman who found herself in a big office in Foggy Bottom but didn't really deserve to be there.
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Old 05-15-2019, 11:54 AM   #1742
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Re: Doesn’t Matter Who Wins the K Race; We’re All the Same

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Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield View Post
Are you serious? If the shoe were on the other foot here and Strzok's texts were exchanged in regard to Hillary's campaign, you and everyone here would be claiming the investigation was tainted.
Try responding to what I've said, instead of to what you imagine I would say in other circumstances. Just try.
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Old 05-15-2019, 11:56 AM   #1743
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Re: A Short Note in Defense of Clowns

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Originally Posted by Pretty Little Flower View Post
I think this is unfair to clowns. Don't get me wrong, I am as guilty as you are. I too have called Sebastian a "clown," a "demented clown," "Bozo the Sad Clown Sean Hannity caricature," the "delusional leader of a broken down right wing clown show," an "emasculated rodeo clown narcissist," and various other clown slurs.

But the truth is, almost every clown I have ever encountered is just some person in make up and a red nose, trying to make children laugh with slapstick antics. I have never known a clown to lie to me. I've never heard a clown proudly announce that he does not have a duty to show empathy to other human beings. No actual clown I know has ever made up facts out of thin air in order to support a dubious argument, or erect an army of straw men to gleefully knock down, or thoroughly misrepresent what he and others said previously in order to farcically claim victory in an online debate. No clown I have encountered would ever say he cannot find the motivation to be concerned about the plight of historically oppressed groups so long as his tax burden is going down. Sebastian does all of these things pretty much every week.

Anyway, you can do what you want of course, but I am going to refrain from calling Sebastian a clown in the future. Because I think I owe that to the clowns.
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Old 05-15-2019, 11:57 AM   #1744
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Re: Doesn’t Matter Who Wins the K Race; We’re All the Same

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Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield View Post
Yes, Strzok's texts tainted the investigation. Comey said as much when he stated that it's a grievous offense for an agent to allow his personal views to infect his work.
I actually read the transcript. He said Strzok damaged the institution. I would bet an awful lot of money that Comey thinks Mueller did a good job, and that Mueller's work stands up. When Comey says Strzok did harm, what he meant is that he gave morons and hacks an excuse to dismiss Mueller's work, just as you are doing.
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Old 05-15-2019, 12:34 PM   #1745
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Re: Doesn’t Matter Who Wins the K Race; We’re All the Same

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He found no evidence of criminal conspiracy.
No, he did not find evidence that was sufficient to bring a charge. How are you still getting this wrong?
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Old 05-15-2019, 01:48 PM   #1746
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Re: Doesn’t Matter Who Wins the K Race; We’re All the Same

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No, he did not find evidence that was sufficient to bring a charge. How are you still getting this wrong?
"What can asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence." - Hitchens' Razor

You are asserting there is evidence adequate to prove criminal conspiracy, but you base this on nothing but your own gut. (Or some silliness about Manafort and Stone keeping quiet.)

I can therefore dismiss that assertion out of hand. You may object to me then making the leap to "there is no evidence of criminal conspiracy," but I'm comfortable doing so. I have the absence of it in Mueller's probe,* and you have nothing but conjecture, or as we describe it when the right wing engages in this sort of thing, "conspiracy theories."

________
* Mueller found facts which Adam Schiff, Bill Barr, and people here would call "collusion." But "collusion" means nothing. Mueller did not find "criminal conspiracy."
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Old 05-15-2019, 01:54 PM   #1747
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Re: Doesn’t Matter Who Wins the K Race; We’re All the Same

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Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop View Post
I actually read the transcript. He said Strzok damaged the institution. I would bet an awful lot of money that Comey thinks Mueller did a good job, and that Mueller's work stands up. When Comey says Strzok did harm, what he meant is that he gave morons and hacks an excuse to dismiss Mueller's work, just as you are doing.
You ignore this statement from Comey:
"Everyone has opinions about political issues and religious issues and sports issues. You can't bring them to work and have them affect your work. There have to be severe consequences."
The "work" of Strzok and Page being discussed by Comey is the Trump investigation.

I'll leave you to look up "affect."
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Old 05-15-2019, 01:54 PM   #1748
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Re: A Short Note in Defense of Clowns

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Originally Posted by Pretty Little Flower View Post
I think this is unfair to clowns. Don't get me wrong, I am as guilty as you are. I too have called Sebastian a "clown," a "demented clown," "Bozo the Sad Clown Sean Hannity caricature," the "delusional leader of a broken down right wing clown show," an "emasculated rodeo clown narcissist," and various other clown slurs.

But the truth is, almost every clown I have ever encountered is just some person in make up and a red nose, trying to make children laugh with slapstick antics. I have never known a clown to lie to me. I've never heard a clown proudly announce that he does not have a duty to show empathy to other human beings. No actual clown I know has ever made up facts out of thin air in order to support a dubious argument, or erect an army of straw men to gleefully knock down, or thoroughly misrepresent what he and others said previously in order to farcically claim victory in an online debate. No clown I have encountered would ever say he cannot find the motivation to be concerned about the plight of historically oppressed groups so long as his tax burden is going down. Sebastian does all of these things pretty much every week.

Anyway, you can do what you want of course, but I am going to refrain from calling Sebastian a clown in the future. Because I think I owe that to the clowns.
I had someone the other day make some bad faith arguments based on a bunch of fallacies, and when I just pointed out the factual errors he said it didn't matter and made up other facts.

So I called him a Sebby, and he scowled at me, and complained that I was slurring him, and attacked me for my obvious bigotry against him in calling him a Sebby.

Try it. It's how all Sebbies react.
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Old 05-15-2019, 02:00 PM   #1749
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Re: Doesn’t Matter Who Wins the K Race; We’re All the Same

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Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield View Post
I was wrong there, but that was my prediction. That's not borrowed.
I didn't say you borrowed it. I said you have been programmed or are predisposed to buy some silly shit like that and argue it to death in the face of obvious evidence to the exact contrary.

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He found no evidence of criminal conspiracy. That is a fact.
No. What the report made clear was that he was unable to establish a criminal conspiracy and he stated that Trump, among others, refused to cooperate.

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Collusion has no meaning, except to people parroting left wing talking points, like you
Once again, you are an idiot. I specifically commented in direct response to you (like I did above) this very point. Your first post after Barr's bullshit memo was a big, "SEE? No collusion," although there is no scenario in which I would dig through your dumbass old posts to prove it.

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to whom it means "quasi-crime" or some other bullshit thing Adam Schiff invented, and you swallow.
You're puling this out of your fucking asshole. My points as it relates to this have been very straightforward and clear enough for even you to understand.

1. Mueller couldn't establish criminal conspiracy but he couldn't make the case because of the lack of cooperation and stonewalling he received from people who were or should have been material witnesses.

2. He laid out a ton of evidence of clear obstruction of justice. You have waived this away with stupid ass bullshit like, "This is true. Ever dealt with a fed criminal prosecution?" Mueller knows Trump committed obstruction. Barr knows it. Every single Republican knows it. We watched him admit to it in a national fucking interview. And you know it.

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What about it? I don't know about it. All I know is they're looking into it. What do you know that I don't know? Are you clerking for the FISA court? Having drinks with Sztrok?
Is this another one of your brilliant "predictions?" And when they inflate the couple of text messages they have into something along the lines of a crime against Trump as you already have, you'll say, "Hey, if you're in power, this is what the rule of law means," or some such other truckload of horseshit.

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You hate Trump and you prejudge things based on that bias.
This is the dumbest fucking line you and every rightwing douchebag run. I've explained this to you a number of times. You can't hear it because you're a fucking moron or you don't want to.

I hate Trump because of his policies and racism and ignorance and sexism and stupidity and greed and corruption. In short, I hate him because of what he is and what he does. That is not a bias, you fucking jackass. Your stupid ass response is the same as if I held you down and fed you a skunk shit sandwich, and when you threw up and got angry, I said, "You hate skunk shit sandwiches because you hate skunk shit and you prejudge the sandwich based on that bias.

It's so stupid that I think we can all agree that I'm mostly correct when I say it is astonishing that someone who passed the bar could even think it.

TM
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Old 05-15-2019, 02:02 PM   #1750
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Re: Doesn’t Matter Who Wins the K Race; We’re All the Same

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Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield View Post
You are asserting there is evidence adequate to prove criminal conspiracy, but you base this on nothing but your own gut. (Or some silliness about Manafort and Stone keeping quiet.)
No, I'm saying there's a difference between "no evidence" and "insufficient evidence." You surely know this, but keep thinking you're fooling someone ignoring it.
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Old 05-15-2019, 02:04 PM   #1751
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Re: Doesn’t Matter Who Wins the K Race; We’re All the Same

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Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop View Post
Try to picture yourself suggesting that a Republican cabinet secretary like Mike Pompeo or William Barr should be criminally prosecuted for making decisions about how his department's servers should be configured. She was the fucking Secretary of State, and she was doing her job. The only way any of this ever becomes an issue is if you pretend that she is just some woman who found herself in a big office in Foggy Bottom but didn't really deserve to be there.
Factually, this fails for a variety of reasons so large it would take forever to unpack. But put that aside, because more interesting, you realize you sound like Barr's defense of Trump here, right?
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Old 05-15-2019, 02:05 PM   #1752
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Re: A Short Note in Defense of Clowns

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Originally Posted by Pretty Little Flower View Post
I think this is unfair to clowns. Don't get me wrong, I am as guilty as you are. I too have called Sebastian a "clown," a "demented clown," "Bozo the Sad Clown Sean Hannity caricature," the "delusional leader of a broken down right wing clown show," an "emasculated rodeo clown narcissist," and various other clown slurs.

But the truth is, almost every clown I have ever encountered is just some person in make up and a red nose, trying to make children laugh with slapstick antics. I have never known a clown to lie to me. I've never heard a clown proudly announce that he does not have a duty to show empathy to other human beings. No actual clown I know has ever made up facts out of thin air in order to support a dubious argument, or erect an army of straw men to gleefully knock down, or thoroughly misrepresent what he and others said previously in order to farcically claim victory in an online debate. No clown I have encountered would ever say he cannot find the motivation to be concerned about the plight of historically oppressed groups so long as his tax burden is going down. Sebastian does all of these things pretty much every week.

Anyway, you can do what you want of course, but I am going to refrain from calling Sebastian a clown in the future. Because I think I owe that to the clowns.
I think that's fair, although the descriptors that precede or directly follow the word, "clown," work to distinguish regular clowns from the type of clown Sebby is. It's like if I said, "Sebby is a brain-dead cock juggler." You wouldn't assume I was disparaging the fine people who make a living juggling.

TM
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Old 05-15-2019, 02:08 PM   #1753
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Re: A Short Note in Defense of Clowns

I'm going to vent about something that has nothing to do with Sebby and on which Sebby will have nothing useful to say (really, Sebby, resist the urge to hit that Reply button).

So I'm interviewing now for a couple of jobs, and have a very good candidate sent to me by a headhunter. She's top 10% of her class, summa, a few years out at a big firm, done interesting things, clearly a good candidate. The headhunter she is working with tells me about eight times, over the court of three phone calls, how "presentable" she is. Headhunter is doing nothing but selling me on her appearance.

Fucking patriarchy.
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Old 05-15-2019, 02:16 PM   #1754
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Re: Doesn’t Matter Who Wins the K Race; We’re All the Same

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Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield View Post
You are asserting there is evidence adequate to prove criminal conspiracy, but you base this on nothing but your own gut. (Or some silliness about Manafort and Stone keeping quiet.)
Seriously, why are you acting like such an idiot. You said there was no evidence. Adder's point was, that's not what Mueller said. Mueller said there wasn't enough evidence to bring charges. If you weren't so committed to being contrarian here, you wouldn't argue with this.
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Old 05-15-2019, 02:17 PM   #1755
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Re: A Short Note in Defense of Clowns

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Originally Posted by Greedy,Greedy,Greedy View Post
I'm going to vent about something that has nothing to do with Sebby and on which Sebby will have nothing useful to say (really, Sebby, resist the urge to hit that Reply button).

So I'm interviewing now for a couple of jobs, and have a very good candidate sent to me by a headhunter. She's top 10% of her class, summa, a few years out at a big firm, done interesting things, clearly a good candidate. The headhunter she is working with tells me about eight times, over the court of three phone calls, how "presentable" she is. Headhunter is doing nothing but selling me on her appearance.

Fucking patriarchy.
I hope you said that to the headhunter.
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