Doesn’t Matter Who Wins the K Race; We’re All the Same

[sebastian_dangerfield]

Originally Posted by Greedy,Greedy,Greedy

I suspect the best thing any community can do to help their economy is help build mosques, temples, synagogues and Christian churches that have services in Spanish, Chinese, and other languages.

I want to vomit agreeing with this, as I find religion both ludicrous and divisive, but yes -- this would help to build communities. It is a good idea.

[Adder]

Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield

Like I said, I do not have a fix. But one thing we could do which would assuage some of the problems would be to globally relax immigration.

Are you getting the sense that low skill workers in the rust belt are excited about new neighbors? Or about emigrating?

[sebastian_dangerfield]

There is so much that could be done, from just old fashioned infrastructure (fixing roads and bridges, building trains) to tech infrastructure (broadband) to a Green New Deal (massive investment in green energy and technology). A lot of those jobs are accessible to low skill workers.

Some of these jobs are available to low skill workers, but not near as many as you think. And often, a contractor can't hire low skill workers because to get insurance and project bonding, you have skill criteria that can be pretty high, and people with convictions are either precluded or drive insurance costs high. Contractor margins are slim. Even small increases make a job unprofitable.

But yes, infrastructure is a good idea and this would create jobs.

We don't do those things because one party either actively campaigns against them as bad (trains) or refuses to pay the taxes needed to do them.

You don't need taxes to do these jobs. You could do a lot of these projects using a mix of public and private money, as they do in Europe. It's good risk for investors and banks, as its guaranteed payment by the state or feds.

Unfortunately, one party insists that this all be done with exclusively public money. (Despite the fact that it puts assets on the books of participating banks, which in fractional banking system allows them to loan more into the Main Street economy! [Lewis Black voice here, screaming.])

That a negligible number of people leave American, and none who are poor, leave American is kinda a big thing that undermines your vision of vasts suffering. People move the other direction for pretty solid reasons.

People don't like to move. Particularly people who don't know anything else and haven't had much education.

Who's nobody? I'd like to let more outsiders in to America.

I'm talking about governments. Ya think Switzerland is interested in having a village of displaced Joe Sixpacks from St. Louis move to Geneva?

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield

You're not a progressive. Not at all.

Ty is a fascist, at least based on how he has ran the one thing ever entrusted to him, this board.

[sebastian_dangerfield]

Originally Posted by Adder

Are you getting the sense that low skill workers in the rust belt are excited about new neighbors? Or about emigrating?

Neither. But since you raise that issue, I'd bet we'd quickly separate the xenophobes (who are also probably the lazy) from the would-be productive rust belters by having immigrants move into those communities. The smart ones would see opportunity and seek to interact. The others would move somewhere even more remote and hopeless.

ETA: Caveat: My assessment of what rust belters think is possibly suspect. I had exposure to many after the 2008 collapse, as I was working a bit in consumer debt. And I grew up with regular exposure to them. But as my wife has told me numerous times, "you've never even worn a uniform, or served anyone." My summer jobs involved lots of driving. I selected things that didn't involve taking orders, or punching a clock. This might be why I really fucking hated working with lots of lawyers.

[Greedy,Greedy,Greedy]

Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield

I want to vomit agreeing with this, as I find religion both ludicrous and divisive, but yes -- this would help to build communities. It is a good idea.

This is getting a lot of play today on some of these issues. I think as close to a "must read" as an econ article could be.

[Adder]

Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield

You don't need taxes to do these jobs. You could do a lot of these projects using a mix of public and private money, as they do in Europe. It's good risk for investors and banks, as its guaranteed payment by the state or feds.

Unfortunately, one party insists that this all be done with exclusively public money. (Despite the fact that it puts assets on the books of participating banks, which in fractional banking system allows them to loan more into the Main Street economy! [Lewis Black voice here, screaming.])

While I'm less eager than you to turn revenue-producing infrastructure over to banks on the assumption that government will get a good deal in the negotiations, I don't think you can say one party says, "no" as no one has realistically put that one the table. Because the president from one party said he wanted that and then backed away from discussions repeatedly.

Personally, I'd take letting the government get swindled if it was the only realistic way to get investment in infrastructure, but I'm not sure it will actually sell well with your disgruntled friends.

ETA: And I'd rather the government borrow at historically low rate (perhaps even negative) than put that money in the banks' pockets.

[Adder]

Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield

The others would move somewhere even more remote and hopeless.

If we could get the people we're talking about to move (with Ty's caveat about housing costs), we'd go a long way toward addressing the issue.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski

Ty is a fascist, at least based on how he has ran the one thing ever entrusted to him, this board.

This is exhausting. Why don't you guys sort out between you whether I'm a fascist or a crypto-libertarian, and then once you've got that straightened out and have agreed among yourselves, I can tell you you're wrong.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

Originally Posted by Adder

If we could get the people we're talking about to move (with Ty's caveat about housing costs), we'd go a long way toward addressing the issue.

Sebby says the problem is that Americans aren't ambitious, and you want to find a way to get them to move? If we could get them to all grow wings, then they could fly wherever they want, but that doesn't mean they'd want to.

[sebastian_dangerfield]

Originally Posted by Greedy,Greedy,Greedy

This is getting a lot of play today on some of these issues. I think as close to a "must read" as an econ article could be.

Calling that a “must-read” is actually an understatement. Every American should have a copy nailed to his front door.

[Greedy,Greedy,Greedy]

Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop

This is exhausting. Why don't you guys sort out between you whether I'm a fascist or a crypto-libertarian, and then once you've got that straightened out and have agreed among yourselves, I can tell you you're wrong.

Wait a minute, are these things mutually exclusive?

[Greedy,Greedy,Greedy]

Originally Posted by Adder

If we could get the people we're talking about to move (with Ty's caveat about housing costs), we'd go a long way toward addressing the issue.

I try to be more welcoming around here. I've proposed to my wife that my old jeep would make a nice lawn ornament, for example.

[Icky Thump]

But on twitter a very famous bass player for a very famous band (with a recent movie) tweeted about how he secretly fantasized about being me.

[Hank Chinaski]

Originally Posted by Icky Thump

But on twitter a very famous bass player for a very famous band (with a recent movie) tweeted about how he secretly fantasized about being me.

Send him a link to an LSAT prep class?