Re: Not just narcissistic, but moronic.
 

Huh? We are doing exactly what we did in egyt in Syria.

Re: Hard to see this ending well.
 

"low grade violence?" Are you fucking nuts, or ignorant? When a government lets an embassy be ransacked it's a statement from that government. When the Iranian "low grade violence" took over the US embassy, did you think that wasn't much?

Israel flew military jets in to evacuate it's embassy staff. If we give 1 dollar to Egypt we are ignorant.

Turkey is not behaving as an ally of the US. It is off the reservation in protecting Hamas. We should tell it if one military boat gets within 100 miles of the coast it will not see dollar 1 for 2 years. The entire construct of letting Israel alone from Turkey and Egypt is based upon US dollars. all the people in those countries would gladly like to see Israel die. It is entirely on us to keep the people we bought behaving, whatever blogs Ty reads nonwithstanding.

What all of you can't seem to get your brain around is that Israel has no right to exist in the most of those governments' plans. and its spinning has infected their peoples. We can't ignore that. To pretend there is a possible actual peace anytime soon would be equivalent to negotiating with the Taliban after 9/11 to understand it's grievances.

Re: Hard to see this ending well.
 

First, what government? There isn't really one. That's potentially really bad. But what is it you think will happen should the armed forces of turkey grt into shooting hostilities with the armed forces of israel? Much worse on any measure.

Also, yeah turkey isn't behaving as an ally. Another reason that isuchbworse than instability in a place that's unstable at the moment.

So yeah, again, your perspective is whack.

Oh, and when you say "they all want israel to die" that's pretty damn antisemetic.

Another thing
 

I suppose in your world Carter should have just told those Iranians we boightto behave and all would have been fine. Clearly he had the same magic wand that Obama has to totally control world events.

Re: Another thing
 

well we didn't give Iran more money, and even Carter didn't support the Iranians once he knew it was against us.

My point was trying to make you understand that the Egyptian government letting the embassy be taken is a horrible sign, far worse than the Turkish government trying to appease its people by fake guarding a few boats. Letting the Israel embassy go is a very real sign that the bet on friendly democracies popping up is not looking good.

Obama needs to step up now to make clear Israel is our prime ally. He should also dismiss Hilllary. fall guy? sure, but it would send a signal.

p.s. today's news from Israel

Re: Hard to see this ending well.
 

lots of Turkish soldiers will die?

right. so obama now needs to take the pressure he has been applying on Israel and tell the Turks doing what it is doing is wrong, unacceptable, and whatever other threats he and Hil have been throwing at Israel.

(edit- I don't see that we even give Turkey $$. Okay, let's let Israel into NATO)


as to your comment about anti-semetism in the mid-east, it negates any weight that can be given to your fuzzy thoughts.

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

Are you accusing me of hypocrisy or proclaiming your own?

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

I freely admit I'm full of shit, so I can't be a hypocrite.

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

The employer side payroll tax cut won't do shit, but I'm thrilled to enjoy its fruit. Hands the old lady a nice chunk of walking around money.

I may vote for him if he promises to run that through 2015.

I may vote for him anyway. If we elect Romney, we may not have all this volatility.

Re: Hard to see this ending well.
 

Sem-i-tism. You're driving me nuts with that misspelling.

Re: Not just narcissistic, but moronic.
 

So if I say that you are either occasionally intoxicated or sexually abusing sheep, I think you would fairly take umbrage at the ovine thing.

They "left Israel hanging"? WTF?

I didn't delete you. Count your lucky stars.

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

Indeed. "We need to spend until the thing rights itself" is brilliant policy.

I get it. Austerity is illogical. I understand and can run with the argument for a while.

But then it gets absurd. The market sees through it. Businesses and the market become dependent upon, and learn how to predict, and goose, government intervention.

At a certain point, you have to start weaning the economy from interventions. All Krugman screams is "More, more, more." Suppose we hand the economy what he suggests. Perhaps there's an argument to be made that a monster stimulus from the start, with no set end date, or limit, would work because the actors in the system would never know when, if ever, it would end. Maybe that would work. But that's politically, and practically, impossible. All we can do is offer a one new fix after another. Stimulus, QEs, twist, refi programs. Everyone sees through, and anticipates the next govt move. The markets demand it. It becomes a pusher/junkie scenario, which undoes all the intent of the underlying policy prescription.

So fuck Krugman. His advice is for a day long past. It's as bad as severe austerity. The answer is what the answer will be: Muddle through. React, to keep a status quo that avoids widespread civil unrest, and let the debt overhang unwind as it will.

It won't be a terrible shit sandwich. When all falls, the guy on top at the outset of collapse holds that position. And you can forget all the shmucks claiming the BRICs would decouple. That's been disproven. We all fall together... And that's good for us.

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

If we're talking disingenuous policies, and absurdities, Obama's 4% refi program's expansion of HARP to include LTVs in excess of 175% takes the cake.

If you're that far underwater, why would you ever refi? You need a principal cut. The program entirely misses the most distressed sector of borrower.

The better plan would be a GSE-like "bad bank" used to soak up all the shit in FL, AZ, MI, Inland CA, and any loan in excess of 175% LTV. And once that's done, remove all those properties from all indexes and give borrowers lease-to-own contracts, or principal write downs.

If you pull the seriously rotten apples out of the data, housing gets better quickly. At least on paper. Sure, it's not a permanent fix, but it's a good start.

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

The problem is that the banks won't sell the loans. There are plenty of buyers out there. More new ventures for this purposes have sprung up since 2008 than you can fathom. It was the new, new thing in 2008/2009. Everyone wanted to buy big portfolios. Unfortunately, due to the price delocation between buyers and sellers, no where near enough paper moved.

We are doomed to ride this out over time. No quick fix.

Re: Not just narcissistic, but moronic.
 

Where were you when Hank and Club were saying that the Arab revolutions were a result of W's fine work in Iraq?

Hepful!
 

Pawlenty must really hate Romney to do this to him.

Not as smart as it thinks it is
 

Linkedin is suggesting that I connect to Robert Bork. Hmmmm.

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

Yeah, like 2009, when he was warning that Obama's half-assed "stimulus" plan, consisting of mostly tax cuts, was a recipe for a double-dip recession. He got no love back then either.

The idea that we need to pay off the national debt RIGHT NOW, at the expense of jobs in the public and private sectors, and without even considering raising taxes, is complete madness, and you don't need to think particularly highly of Paul Krugman to reach that conclusion. But that's the hymn sheet the Democrats are (mostly) singing from right now, so I guess we'll continue down this road until unemployment is at 15%.

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

Speaking of Krugman, his blog about Guilliani and Bush was fucking distasteful and one of the prime reasons why I hate him. He should stick to economics. Posts like that make people like me question everything he writes/says as being politically motivated.

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

I didn't read it. But I find both Giuliani and Bush to be fucking distasteful, so now I probably will.

PS - why does Krugman have to be tasteful? He's not a politician, and when it comes to pundits of all stripes (and I include the more exotic fauna on FOX and MSNBC here, just so you won't question) I have to think he's trailing pretty far behind in the Fucking Distasteful sweepstakes. Also, if Hank has dedicated years of his life to imparting one lesson to all of us here, it's that it doesn't matter if you're tasteless asshole, as long as you're right. And I for one will not stand here and listen to you insult Hank Chinaski.

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

Well, someone ought to respond.

Giulliani of course was just another vain politican doing what he could to take advantage of the situation - I'm not sure why one calls him out for abuse, and I think his role on 9/11 itself was capable, even if what followed was a bit tawdry. But still a better brand of tawdry than Perry running on his record of executions, for example.

Bush, however, managed to turn the attack into cheerleading for an attack on a country irrelevant to the bombings, several thousand US deaths and untold numbers of Iraqi deaths, and he managed to do it with evidence that appears to be somewhere between flimsy and fabricated. Bush pretty much deserves whatever Krugman can give him. I don't think his neo-con objectives justify any of the crap he slung.

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

I went to read his column just now and it's a new one about the moralization of debt and how it's fucking up the European response to their crisis. It was good. And judging from the above, I think I know what he said about Giuliani and Bush and 9-11, which is nothing that hasn't been said a thousand times before, so I'll skip reading that. Cheers.

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

Here it is:

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

Just as I thought. And I agree with that completely, as if anyone were in any doubt.

I understand that there are adjectives in there, but do you really disagree with the part about how the Bush administration used the attack to justify the invasion of Iraq? Is anyone still defending that war on the grounds upon which it was originally sold to us?

But I guess this is the one that really got to you: "The memory of 9/11 has been irrevocably poisoned; it has become an occasion for shame. And in its heart, the nation knows it." This is clearly untrue for the small number of people who acted heroically on the day, and the days after, to save lives. But I'll own up and say that I spent most of that day watching CNN and drinking bourbon, so I can't take issue with it on that basis. And I also can't really disagree that it was turned into a political football to justify a lot of shit that was just clearly wrong, and wasteful, and deadly.

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

I do.

Ahh, do you mean Obama's Predator murders, or his executing an unarmed Osama in front of his daughter and without trial?

Re: Another thing
 

And you know the not yet extant government in Egypt is "not with us?"

what signal? That we really don't want them to be with us?

But in all seriousness, why? What do we get out of declaring the Arab word our enemy? And why do you think that will be of greater benefit to israel than remaining engaged?

Re: Hard to see this ending well.
 

yes, you generalize across multiple people and I'm the one with fuzzy thoughts. You clealy have the Cheney clarevoyance. It's amazing how simple the world is if you buy caricature wholesale.

T-r-o-l-l
 

Hey! Adder! Here's an invitation to have a one way conversation with someone who took a left turn out of reality half a life back. Enjoy!

Re: Another thing
 

btw, I will expect you to revise your win record to reflect this forfeiture on 8 years of W foreign policy.

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

just when I was going to call you full of shit.

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

Not really, but isn't Gitmo the third leg of this tired little stool you always squat on whenever you hear someone crossing your bridge? Suprised you left it out this time.

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

Didn't read it, but everything he writes s politically motivated. Just like every other pundit.

Eta. Im disturbed that you might think this criticism is uniquely suited.

Brilliant!
 

I am looking forward to Ty's posting on underwater zombies.

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

in all seriousness: what is your point? What do you want others to take away from your comment?

Because the message you send when you imply that any subsequent wrong immunized all prior mistakes (to be charitable) is that your only goal is to be an ass.

If that's all you are aiming for please let me know so I can put you on ignore instead of continuing to give you the benefit of the doubt.

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

Seriously, you thought Hank had a point?

He's an ass. Recognize this. Most likely, he's embarrassed about his own vituperative support for invading Iraq, and his own Bilmore-like fulminating against anyone who questioned the evidence of WMDs. So, blame Clinton, blame Obama, blame anyone but the people responsible.

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

Whoa! You think Hank is capable of embarassment?

Re: Brilliant!
 

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

everyone here said W was bad, that he violated people's rights, and that he was misguided, criminal in doing so. I said what he did might be justified by things he knew only because he was president.

Obama ran promising to stop all the rights abuses. Once he was aware of what the President is told he not only didn't stop the abuses he has ramped them up. I support the ramp up, but am quite certain that what Obama has done has gone to prove I was right that W's actions were prudent. It would hard to imagine clearer evidence,

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

I didn't watch much TV this weekend, but what little I did see reinforced that I have no problem with this. None. At. All.

ETA: And to reply to your post right above, if this had happened during W's term, I'd have felt the same way.

Re: My God, you are an idiot.
 

no. any person's right to trial is sacred. we could have captured him and given him a fair trial under US law. When we execute anyone w/o trial it is the same as taking away your fundamental rights. Shame!