Quote:
Originally Posted by Greedy,Greedy,Greedy
I am in the category of people who genuinely like Hillary as well. And it is not just that she is smart and well-informed. She is a battle-hardened, seen-it-all, put up with no bullshit auntie, who has got a good heart and claws of steel.
I find the number of us who really like her small among white men but much larger in other demographics. It is very annoying how often white men just presume Hillary put-downs are ok and everyone should just go along.
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I agree with all of the positive things said about her here (other than Sebby's "no one hates her" line, which is ridiculous). The negative that I agree with is NotBob's "positioning" comment. Her vote on the Iraq war, in particular, was cowardly IMO. I do not believe she honestly thought it was a good idea, but she was afraid to stand on that.
I think many people view that as indicative of an overall willingness to change her position to what she views as popular or advantageous. I do not agree with that. She was not unique, or even unusual, among Dems who were cowed by the post-9/11 war fervor, and that was exactly what W, Rove, Cheney, FOX, and many many other were trying to accomplish with the "if you oppose war you support Saddam, and terrorists, and al Qaeda, and granny-rape" hysteria. (Ah, memories.... Bilmore and his "murder-marchers" polemics...)
People's willingness to see that instance as a broad indicator is, of course, driven to a great extent by their overall feelings towards her, which in many cases are a seething hatred driven by her sex and her refusal to play the gender role that was expected of women of her age. But, at least among those who lack the seething hatred, I see the legitimacy of the concerns, to an extent.
If I had the choice, I would rather vote for someone who had the courage and leadership to stand against the Iraq War, but my first priority is someone highly competent, effective, and not engaging in pipe dreams.
