Election 2010: Teabaggin' the Ds & Rs

[Penske 2.0]

Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop

Because he has already been fired, so it's really besides the point now to talk about all of the things NPR could have considered before it acted.



Ex ante, sure, but since they've fired him now it's far more instructive to talk about the actual facts ex post. I'm not aware of a shred of evidence that he was fired for his age or race.

I actually understand that people who are fired for good reasons can bring baseless claims against their former employers to extract a little money on their way out the door. That's ordinarily the sort of thing that Penske would complain about. In the way that he abandons those principles to take Williams' side against NPR, you can tell that Penske is truly a conservative at heart.



From the story I saw, it's clear that NPR's management has had issues with Williams' appearances elsewhere for a while, and believe that he has been doing things inconsistent with its standards. For that reason, I think it's silly to think that they overreacted quickly to this one incident. I think they've been considering their position for a while.



I wasn't aware that listeners felt that way. I just thought he was insipid. But so is Cokie Roberts, so what can you do?



I think NPR saw a fundamental tension between the sorts of commentary he gave at Fox and the role they expected him to play at NPR. It wasn't long ago that they asked him to stop identifying himself with his NPR affiliation when he appeared at Fox. At the time I thought that was silly -- it was accurate, and if they didn't like it I thought they should be focus on what he said on their airwaves.

And now they have.

Translation: I still don't get it.

[sebastian_dangerfield]

Originally Posted by Replaced_Texan

Why are they pointless?* I think an EEOC claim is still viable for quite some time. I don't know necessarily if it'd prevail, but certainly he could make a race or age discrimination claim. (Bob Edwards, in my opinion, had a better case for the latter, but that's another story.) My organization certainly would have waited a day or two to review the issue before making any quick decisions to terminate the contract.

I know that NPR listeners have been annoyed with Williams for years now, and the corporation was probably very eager to get him the hell out of there. But it did seem very quick. OTOH, this is the same organization that first forbade its news staff from attending Jon Stewart's rally as attendees on the basis that it may be perceived as political and therefore the news staff would be showing bias. And after his statements on Fox, I don't think I'd ever want to hear his analysis on anything about Muslims again. Given the world we live in and the role he had at NPR as a news analyst, there is a high likelihood that his job would require him to analyze issues revolving around Muslims. His analysis would be suspect going forward. I think his termination was probably appropriate, but it probably was a little faster than I would have advised had anyone bothered to ask me.

*Disclosure, according to my bank statement, my last contribution to an NPR affiliate was six days ago, and after Planned Parenthood, it is the non-profit that gets the most frequent charitable contributions from me. I rely on NPR for most of my news.

I think it was stupid, and will now place NPR, something I listen to everyday, in the crosshairs of the right wing smear machine. NPR has been a little left over the years, but in an interesting, good way, and now they're going to be embroiled in a stupid controversy that's going to cause the station to edit out any hint of opinion. They'll become CNN. Start doing dumb pieces on Toby Keith to show their "fair and balanced" bona fides.

Oh, and the guy didn't deserve to be fired. It was a horrible overreaction to an absolutely harmless admission by a talking head trying to be as open as possible with his audience. Good for him that Fox turned around and handed him a $2mil contract.

[sebastian_dangerfield]

Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop

I think it's unlikely. But it also seems unlikely that Sharron Angle or Joe Miller or Pat Toomey could be elected Senator, but that's who the respective state parties put up, and it's a year that favors outsiders.

Toomey's been building a machine for years. And he's in no way comparable to an idiot like Angle. She's O'Donnell Lite.

[Penske 2.0]

Originally Posted by Greedy,Greedy,Greedy

There is no hypocrisy here. The right defended the free speech rights of the corporate shills who fired each of those reporters.

Maybe I don't follow these people closely enough but the difference I see between williams and

(i) thomas, is i see him as a commentator, and her as a reporter/journalist. I would expect the latter to pretend to be more objective, as a matter of professionalism;

(ii) pass, I didn't follow that one closely enough, although I think she was less a commentator than a reporter, i.e. see above; and

(iii) I don't know that I posted about it here, but I thought CNN's firing of Sanchez was heavy handed, notwithstanding that I am stalwart FotJs.

My criticism of NPR was, in part, on the employment law subject as RT noted, and (b) because I don't like NPR. for the same reason I don't like Fox. Shrill extremists.

[sebastian_dangerfield]

Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop

I'm going to go way out on a limb here and say that California lets an employer consider someone's political views and public statements when deciding whether to employ them as a political commentator.

Odd to see Penske lecturing me about how to run a business and then turn around and say that NPR shouldn't have fired Juan Williams, a man who to the best of my knowledge hasn't uttered an original or interesting thought on the radio in several years, because firing him wasn't fair.

It shows how little Penske knows about HR matters. Which tends to prove how much he probably knows about running a profitable business. One does not go with the other.

[sebastian_dangerfield]

Originally Posted by Penske 2.0

Maybe I don't follow these people closely enough but the difference I see between williams and

(i) thomas, is i see him as a commentator, and her as a reporter/journalist. I would expect the latter to pretend to be more objective, as a matter of professionalism;

(ii) pass, I didn't follow that one closely enough, although I think she was less a commentator than a reporter, i.e. see above; and

(iii) I don't know that I posted about it here, but I thought CNN's firing of Sanchez was heavy handed, notwithstanding that I am stalwart FotJs.

My criticism of NPR was, in part, on the employment law subject as RT noted, and (b) because I don't like NPR. for the same reason I don't like Fox. Shrill extremists.

The Sanchez firing was almost as unjustified. He should have been compelled to apologize. Lou Dobbs got away with saying much worse. And no, his ratings at the time weren't much better than Sanchez's.

[Penske 2.0]

Originally Posted by Greedy,Greedy,Greedy

Is your criticism that they didn't do a good job of firing him?

Or they that he should not have been fired.

If 1, 2.

If 2, who gives a shit? He's $2 million better off, and both NPR and Fox are improved.

1 not 2. I don't listen/watch either of NPR or Fox with any regularity that I care. If CNN had fired him I might have been critical, as (i) I watch CNN and (b) to the limited extent I have seen Juan Williams in the last 20 years (i used to read him regularly back in the 80s/early 90s) I think his PoV is interesting.

[sebastian_dangerfield]

Originally Posted by cheval de frise

CDF
(Palin's VP nomination was the final straw that sealed my vote for Obama. It also ensured I wouldn't consider changing my registration to Republican. Then again, I'm under no illusion that most people think the way I do.)

That hesitance couldn't more unjustified. I was lucky enough to have caught Chris Hitchens speaking a few weeks ago and he made the same point, to considerable applause. Before a very conservative audience.

[Penske 2.0]

Originally Posted by Cletus Miller

If I were unable to distinguish between the two, I *would* be stupid, so none taken.

Are you genuinely unable to distinguish many of the things you equate on this board? If so, you might be as stupid as your secretary sock. No offense.

1. you have to be more specfic, which things?

2. My secretary sock is in law school. just wait until she has a JD and you will see reel intellectual heft.

[Adder]

Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop

"They were looking for a reason to get rid of me because I appear on Fox News," Williams says.

How does this affect his discrimination claim?

eta: Williams also has this to say:



With his need to see himself as a victim (the gulag!), he'll fit right in with the conservatives at Fox.

Probably never occurred to him that he was as total shit replacement for Ray Saurez.

[Adder]

Originally Posted by cheval de frise

Call me crazy, but I don't think she'll end up running.

You are crazy. She will run, if only to add a zero to her check from Fox News.

[Penske 2.0]

Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop

"They were looking for a reason to get rid of me because I appear on Fox News," Williams says.

How does this affect his discrimination claim?
.

If he was so disposed, I think the following is the more telling statement:

by management that has no use for a diversity of opinion, ideas or a diversity of staff (I was the only black male on the air).

If you think the first statement you cited would have any mitigating affect on the use of this second statement, you are again evidencing that you have not practiced before the EEOC.

[Adder]

Originally Posted by sebastian_dangerfield

They'll become CNN. Start doing dumb pieces on Toby Keith to show their "fair and balanced" bona fides.

Let's not get carried away.

Oh, and the guy didn't deserve to be fired.

Not for that statement, no. For overall suckiness, yes.

[Penske 2.0]

Originally Posted by Atticus Grinch

A wish to build a dream on.

Yes. A boy can dream. My fall back is a government job.

[Penske 2.0]

Originally Posted by cheval de frise

(Palin's VP nomination was the final straw that sealed my vote for Obama. It also ensured I wouldn't consider changing my registration to Republican. Then again, I'm under no illusion that most people think the way I do.)

My equation on the vote was the same. I switched my registration to D after W won the second time.